Sales Hustle is now Sales Transformation
May 10, 2021

Episode #95 S1-EP95 What Sales Leaders Need To Do To Elevate Their Sales In New Environments with Alice Heiman

Alice Heiman joins Collin Mitchell in this episode of the Sales Hustle podcast. Let’s hear from Alice as she gives a review of her sales career from where she started and all the way to becoming a go-to consultant in building and fortifying World Class Sales Organizations.

Alice Heiman is one of the most sought after entrepreneur sales coaches who Founded and is Chief Sales Officer of Alice Heiman, LLC. It is where she extensively demonstrates the direct correlation between sales performance and a leader’s mindset as she firmly believes and practices that a sales leader’s approach to their sales team immediately and dramatically determines the sales results. 

Alice has spent over 20 years training sales professionals all over the US on a variety of skills, strategies, and tactics. Despite the fact that sales wasn’t the first choice for her career path, she still found her way in establishing her name in the industry that’s separate from her father, Miller Heiman who owns Miller Heiman Group - one of the most recognized pioneering sales training service providers in the US. Further proving that her talents are deeply rooted into her genes, Alice is a thought leader who is always incorporating the newest research and best practices into her sales programs which are proven and tested to master the complexities of sales and accelerate results. From generating leads, handling objections, closing deals, to retaining customers and getting a consistent flow of referrals, she’s an expert in simplifying the sales process that would fit the company’s culture. 

Alice will be launching her own podcast that features CEOs of mature companies that are within the $10 - 100 Million range as they talk about how they built their organizations and the things they do to keep their sales in a constant progression. Found out more when you visit her website at

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Episode 95 - Alice Heiman

Welcome to the sales hustle. The only no BS podcast, where we bring you the real raw uncut experiences from sales change makers across various industries. The only place where you can get what you're looking for too. Uh, your sales game today's episode is brought to you by sales cast sales cast helps sales professionals transformed the relationship building process and win their dream clients.

[00:00:30] I'm your host, Colin Mitchell. What is happening? Sales hustlers. Welcome to another episode. I am super fired up for today's guest. I've got Alice Heiman. Alice works with CEOs and leaders that have a B2B complex sell to evolve and elevate their sales organizations so that they can focus on their customer and increase ultimately and get their high, get a higher value valuation for their company.

[00:00:56] Alice, welcome to sales house. So how are you doing? I'm doing great. How are you calling? I'm doing fantastic. I'm really happy to get you on here. And I know we've got some exciting topics for the sales hustlers listening, but before we jump in for those folks who, I don't know, maybe been sleeping under a rock, why don't you give them just the short version of your sales story?

[00:01:17] Oh my gosh. Well, the short version is I didn't start in sales. I never planned to be in sales. You know, it wasn't even on my radar. Right. However, my dad was in sales his entire life, so I don't know why it wasn't on my radar screen, but it wasn't. I started in education. I did that for 13 years and then I jumped in or was catapulted into the world of business.

[00:01:40] When I joined Miller Heiman, the company that my father founded with Bob Miller, many of you know, it's one of the world's renowned sales training organization. So that was my. Catapult into business. And then I'm in 1997. I started my own company and I have been working with CEOs and sales leaders to increase their sales and the valuation of their company ever since.

[00:02:04] Wow. Okay. Now you did keep it short. So, uh, uh, tell me just was, uh, like, you know, not intending to get in sales, but with, you know, your father's like life dedicated to sales. Uh, was there some reluctance to get into sales for you or, or what was it, why did, why did, was it not on the radar? It just never even crossed my mind as a career, but you know, my generation, which is.

[00:02:31] Uh, you know, I'm a bit older than you are calling just, you know, a couple of years. And, uh, it wasn't, I don't know. It just wasn't even a thing. Like we weren't encouraging women to go into science or business much back then. Uh, women were teachers or nurses or other helping professions and maybe secretaries, things like that.

[00:02:54] And I actually didn't have my mind on any of those. I loved art and I did a lot of art my whole life, and I actually went to college to study art. So, you know, it just wasn't on my radar. Is art still a passion for you? Um, it is, it is. Um, I don't actually sad, sadly I don't paint or weave or, or do any of the other art types of things that I used to do, but I appreciate art very much and I support, uh, the local artists here in my town.

[00:03:31] Uh, but yeah, my art now comes out. My creativity, my art comes out in the way that I solve problems and the strategies that I build for companies who want to increase their sales. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, I think a lot of salespeople don't think of themselves as creative people, but they kind of have to be today.

[00:03:52] Um, if they want to have any level of success now, you know, since you specifically work with, you know, CEOs and leaders, we've got a great topic that, um, Um, I'm just kind of fired up to dig into what do sales leaders need to do to elevate their sales today. And, you know, in an environment that's very different than, than previously.

[00:04:10] And a lot of folks not hitting quota, uh, and a lot of leaders and CEOs kind of ripping their hair out, like saying, what do we do? Yeah. So it's, it's a big, big problem, you know, more than we can cover here today. But I think there are a few key things. Uh, the world, you know, sped up. In many, many ways during this pandemic.

[00:04:32] Right? So it will never go back. It's not, it's not going back where it was only going forward. And I think the rate of change will continue. I do believe that we have to change our mindset around sales. And it's been happening, but in my opinion, way too slowly, we've got to start to think more about the way the decision-makers want to buy from us.

[00:05:04] And we're taking some lessons from business to consumer. And I think some of those are helpful. One of them being that people want to. Get on and buy what they want to buy without having to talk to a sales person, if they don't want to and are they want to chat right. And get their answers quickly, they don't want to wait on the phone and they don't want to have to make an appointment and they want to get on and chat and get the information that they need.

[00:05:32] They want to find what they need easily on your website. So we all know that we've known it for a while. Right. But it is amazing how slowly companies are coming around to that. Uh, being, being able to allow a buyer to move through the cycle that they need to, to do their decision-making process on their own.

[00:05:56] You know, so the first thing that we could do to make it easier and, and become modern sellers is to just provide the right information. At the right time, in a way that it can be consumed without a salesperson being involved. Now I am in, by no stretch of the imagination saying that I believe salespeople are going to disappear.

[00:06:17] I think salespeople are very important, but that's the second thing is I think we need a different type of sales person and we need to train them differently. So w w company leaders need to look at sales. And how we're going to do a better job with sales, not just sellers and how we're going to get sellers to do a better job.

[00:06:39] That's a huge switch. Right. So they talk about that a lot at Gartner, um, which, you know, I'm on Gardner sales council and we have to, as company leaders make that switch to, we are in charge of sellers too. We are in charge of sales, which means basically we're in charge of how the buyer wants to buy from us.

[00:07:02] And that is just a different mindset. So one let's get the material, the videos, the reading, the, you know, everything that a customer needs to help them make a decision. And let's. Post-it where they go. You've got to know where your audience is, right. Go where they are and post that there. So they have that experience, right.

[00:07:26] Then let's have let's hire and train the right kind of sales people who know how to intersect with the buyer, wherever the buyer comes in. Right. Whenever the, raise their hand and say, now I'm ready to talk. So instead, what we do is we have salespeople who know how to do things like band. You know what Banton.

[00:07:46] Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That is so 1980s. If I hear one more person telling a salesperson to do band, I'm getting to like grow up, grow up for sure. So of course you have to know whether they have a budget and whether they have authority and whether they have a need and what the time is. Of course you do, but. In the natural course of things, you will gather that information.

[00:08:09] More importantly, I need to know where you are right now as a decision maker. So what drove you to look for a solution? What have you done so far to get the information you need for that solution? Right. And where, what do you need from me? To move forward. Then I can bring some insights, pose some questions, you know, maybe do a demo or whatever else.

[00:08:36] But if we don't figure out where the buyer is, we start them way back at the beginning because we're at the beginning and no buyer wants to go through that. That's why they they'd rather just. Not talk to a sales rep for many cases. So what I hear you're saying is adapting the pro the, the, the sales process to meet the buyer's needs and where they are, and also being flexible with it as well, because people are going to come in at different stages based on.

[00:09:08] You know, how much of your content they've consumed? How many of your resources, if hopefully you're making those available in the right places. Um, and they might be at the beginning, they might be a little bit further along, but nobody's asking these buyers, like, what have you done? Where are you at? What do you need?

[00:09:27] How can I help? And all of these things to just really be a resource to help them make a decision. Even if that decision is not, you. Right. Exactly. Baby. The best solution is not your solution and you need to be. Wise enough to point that out and then maybe point them in the right direction. Because if you do that, they're going to trust you.

[00:09:51] Uh, they'll come back to you when it is the right solution. They'll take you with them. If they move to a new company that needs, that solution they'll know to call you, or they might be happy to refer you to someone else. So every interaction that you have with. You know, a potential decision-maker is an opportunity to build a relationship that could last a lifetime and provide referrals and more business.

[00:10:21] You even know in that moment in time, it won't be a piece of business. Yeah. And there's a few things like it's no, it's, it's so frustrating when you go to a website and there's a, there's a tab at the top and it says pricing, right. It says pricing and you're like, Oh great. I can see what the price is.

[00:10:38] Right. And then you go to the pricing page and it's a form to submit for a demo or to talk to an SDR or BDR now. Right. Nothing against STRs BDRs. Like they're important, you know, I'm a big fan of outbound. However, there's some people that might be further along the process that, you know, they want to get some answers and don't want to have to go through this interrogation of questions to get to somebody who can give them the information that they want based on where they're at.

[00:11:07] Right. And, you know, it used to be years ago when I taught selling, you know, We would talk about when, when do you deliver the price? You know, when do you let them know what the price of the product is too early? They don't understand the value yet.  Oh my gosh, that's too high. Right too late in the process or losing interest.

[00:11:27] It's like, look, I've got to build a budget here. I need to know the price. Right. So. Uh, I, I think there's a lot of issues around that. And especially in a business, a business complex sale where the pricing is variable depending on different things. And, uh, it's, you know, not probably. That easy to just go, Oh, here's the price?

[00:11:50] Cause there's some calculations and things that have to be made. Um, I think that more and more companies, especially companies who are selling, um, technology software as a service where it is either a monthly or an. Annual reoccurring are doing a better job of getting that onto their website. It's real clear if you have this many people you pay this much and there are some upfront costs, which we can discuss with you when we talk about, or you could just have some sort of baseline, right?

[00:12:18] Like something. But not this, you know, sales, marketing trickery of like, Hey, you know, you got to talk to three people before I can even give you an idea of what it's going to cost to work with us. Right, right. Yes. Yeah. So I think that that's, again, just one of those things that if you're understanding how the buyer wants to buy, then you're going to provide the things that a buyer would want.

[00:12:43] You know, depending on where they are in their decision-making process. And then that would bring me to really a third thing. I think calling that every, um, company needs to take a look at company leaders need to think about the way they make purchases. Um, they need to think about the. The day in the life of the type of buyer they're asking their salespeople to call on.

[00:13:08] Right. And they need to ask themselves, are we providing that same experience to the people who buy from us that we would like if we were buying and I can tell you right now, the answer is no, because Collin, when I look at a CEO and I say to him, Hey. Or her listen, how many calls do you take per day from an SDR?

[00:13:34] Who's trying to reach you to schedule an appointment with her AA. Just about how many? Zero, zero. And by the way, Colin, just curious, how many emails per day do you. Respond to, from an SDR or a sales person. Who's sending you some sales messaging, all about their company, product and services. About how many of those do you respond to every day, big fat, zero, right?

[00:14:08] But you. CEO are asking your sales leaders and your sales team to send thousands of those emails out to people just like you every single day and who call hundreds of people like you every single day. And you just told me you don't respond. So I'm having a little trouble getting these two together, right?

[00:14:33] Yeah. It seems like such a simple concept that people should grasp onto, but they're not for whatever reason. So what is the, what is the solution to this? Like how can sales leaders and CEOs. Right now, if they're listening, stop this madness and start to make some changes that can actually start to create a sales process.

[00:14:58] That's more in line with the way their buyers want to buy. Yeah. First aid number one. Ask your bypass. I knew, I knew, I knew you were going to, I think that was going to be your answer you sell to now. So you have a list of customers, so many things, so many people don't do that. Customers they have at each customer.

[00:15:18] You probably have two, three, four, five, eight or 12 people who were involved in making the decision right now. They know you and love you and trust you, call them up and say today when you're buying something. What do you want from a seller? What kind of information do you need? Walk me through how you're making decisions to purchase this type of thing today.

[00:15:42] And, um, get that information from them. Do a panel of a day in the life of the buyer, like get some CFOs from two or three of your client companies, put them on a panel, invite your sales team to it. And. Let them ask all the questions. What kind of, as the jinx gets you excited, what kind of things do you respond to?

[00:16:03] How do you find new products and services? Where do you go? Who do you ask day in the life of the buyer? Like what do you do all day? What keeps you busy? Get these kinds of programs available to your salespeople, ask your own customers, ask your own CFO to talk to the salespeople. If they call on CFOs or CMOs or directors of whatever, if you have one of those people at your own company, get them to talk to your salespeople about what their day is like, what keeps them busy all day.

[00:16:33] How many hours a day they work, what they respond to, what messaging resonates with them. Okay. Just get schooled on the buyer. What does the Spire look like today? Okay. And not what's keeping you up at night, please. Don't ask that question. What's up? The new puppy I just bought that is got to go to the bathroom every 10 minutes, you know, or my aunt.

[00:17:03] Did you get a new puppy? No, but I'm about to, I just, I just got a new puppy two weeks ago. Yeah. So, you know, that's not the right question and it doesn't make me think of the right thing. Yeah. If you want to know, what's challenging me at my company, then research my industry and find out some things that are going on and say in your industry, these things are happening.

[00:17:26] Can you tell me about how that's impacting your company? That's a way better question than what's keeping you up at night. Yeah. And, and for the F for the people that are going to have all of the classic excuses of why they can't do this, the buyers are busy. They don't have time. We don't want to bother him.

[00:17:43] You know, all of these things like this is really simple to do, like. Get some people together, buy them lunch, make a donation to a charity that they care about to show up and just spend an hour with them asking questions and, you know, understand them better so that your sales team can be more effective and, you know, have more quality messaging and conversations.

[00:18:05] So Colin, oddly enough, just because of LinkedIn, the way that it is one of the top buyers at Ford, right. Ford motor company wanted to talk to me. I don't know why, because he was a buyer not buying anything that I sell and I don't even work with companies that size. Right. But, uh, there was something interesting that I had posted or whatever he wanted to talk about it.

[00:18:28] I said, well, that's great. Cause I want to talk to you and I want to understand how you're buying things these days. What are your buying teams look like? Cause he was in charge of sort of this, um, startup inside of Ford motor, where he had autonomy and he had his budget and you know, he's people would go out to buy certain types of things.

[00:18:46] And so as I was talking to him and I said, well, do you want to talk to salespeople? He goes, Oh yes. I really do want to talk to salespeople, especially the ones who have something new or innovative and understand my industry and what I'm trying to accomplish. Bingo. So guess what? Sales people, right.

[00:19:02] Buyers do want to talk to you. Decision makers do want to talk to you when you have something insightful that is about their industry, something innovative, some way to help them do something better. But when you just talk about yourself, your product, your company, hi, I'm Alice. I want to introduce myself.

[00:19:19] My company is so and so, and we sell so and so. Stop doing that, that doesn't help me know anything. Right. So instead you have to know enough about my industry to catch my intention with something engaging. That's going to help make me think. Ooh, that could put me ahead. That could give me an edge against my competition.

[00:19:39] Then I do want to talk to you and I will talk to you. But what else was interesting? Is, he was saying how much he was missing and his team was missing the interaction in person with salespeople. Okay. And I said, well, that's interesting because salespeople are missing that with you also. But I said, if a sales person were to offer you a virtual lunch or a virtual coffee or a virtual activity of some type, and I gave him some examples of what I was thinking about, would you and your team participate in that?

[00:20:11] He said, absolutely. That sounds like it'd be a load of fun. So I'm sitting here thinking I'm talking to one of the, you know, a key person that I hear Angus corporation, who is telling me that he wants to talk to salespeople who have great ideas for him. People telling me they can't get people like him to talk.

[00:20:34] Yeah. He just debunked every excuse that every sales person has ever made up of why they can't talk to people like them. Um, so yeah, now Colin and, and this is again, what we, as sales leaders and company leaders are doing. We have tremendous pressure on us to increase sales sometimes from our investors.

[00:20:57] Or from company leaders, the CEO is saying, what is going on in sales over there? Why are the salespeople not hitting their quota? Why can't you forecast correctly? You know, why aren't our sales, you know, here, there, wherever the CEO wants them to be. Right. And so as you start to think about this and you think, all right, you're, you're saying, go do something.

[00:21:20] Do something, what, right. What let's do something innovative and different. Let's not send more emails that are getting us very low response rates. Let's not make more, a hundred more phone calls that are getting us a very low response rate instead of that. What could we do? That would make sales easier and make people want to talk to us, stop pushing the more button and start pushing the better button so that things get easier for everyone, easier for the people trying to buy from you and easier for the.

[00:21:59] Sales team and the SMEs and the customer to assess the entire team. That's out customer facing, trying to draw those customers in, but yet they're not, they just keep making more dials. Now there there's great tools to help us do that. So if you are going to cold call for goodness sake, use one of these terrific tools that will dial for you and make it faster, better than it is now.

[00:22:25] But why would you do something that gives you. Such a low response rate. When you could talk to your current customers, tell them how much you love them and, and say that you want more customers just like them. Give them three to five names of companies you would love to break into and see if they can make an introduction for you.

[00:22:45] If I spent my day doing that as a sales person, not only would I be less fatigued from dialing and sending and social media ING, I would actually be having real conversations with people on the phone every day. And some of those people would absolutely introduced me to people who would have. More conversations with me every day.

[00:23:09] And what does every salesperson want conversations with people who can potentially buy from them? How do we get those? We can use referrals to do it. Um, all right. Uh, sales hustlers, you might need to hit, rewind and listen to that one more time, especially if you're a sales leader. Um, I love going to the customers and getting information, but also another thing that I love is going to the deals lost, going to the non-customers and getting that feedback.

[00:23:38] I did it today. I, you know, sent an email, somebody who didn't get, you know, go with us for whatever reason. Totally fine. And he decided that. Weeks ago, but I've been hunting him down because I want to know why I'm not going to give up until I get some feedback that can help us be better and, you know, give the buyer the experience they want.

[00:23:58] Maybe we weren't as clear as we should have been on something maybe. We didn't explain something that he was confused on, whatever the case is, and the intention is not to get them back in the sales funnel. The intention is really like, Hey, I'm curious. I want to learn, how can we be better? How, what do we need?

[00:24:13] Is there something we need to maybe change? And so it's easy to go back to the people that have bought from you, but the people that didn't, we'll give you some very interesting feedback that could help you make some really big changes in your messaging, in your process and all of those things. Well, Colin, I always say part ways gracefully, no matter what the outcome, because you do want to be able to collect that kind of information and you do want future opportunities.

[00:24:40] So what we do though, in sales, even though we say we're not transactional, we are so transactional, you know, move the buyer through the process. Get the papers signed, you know, get them, you know, pass it over to the onboarding team and get out there and go get another one. Right? Yeah. Um, what about building a relationship that lasts?

[00:25:02] What about, um, showing the customer how much you care or what about. You know, keeping in touch with them, you know, to see how the onboarding is going. Now, I know there are salespeople out here who do this. I know they are because I've had the pleasure of working with them. But on mass, the bolt, yeah. Of the salespeople out there are not doing it.

[00:25:24] And this is one of the reasons we can't get referrals because of the way we have segmented sales these days. So you have an SDR that, or a BDR that makes an appointment. Then you have an AED that dah, dah, dah, dah, and then you have. Bring in a subject matter expert and they did that. And then the demo, and then they PA then you got to meet the customer success people in the onboarding team, and they got out of that.

[00:25:44] And then, then you get an account manager who takes care of you with your customer success team. Who's building that long lasting relationship and earning the right to ask for those referrals or for the renewal or, and for the renewal. Well, which should be the account team. That's customer success, right?

[00:26:02] But again, each time we pass the, pass the customer off to the next set of people, we're dealing with one, two or three people. And it may be that keeps changing on our side and on theirs. And what we haven't done, men has gone wide and deep into the organization to connect with all of the people who were originally involved in making the decision and their bosses, so that we're stickier, right.

[00:26:27] Getting our leaders to align with their leaders. So that the ref, the renewal is not even a question. Right. And so that the referrals come so naturally because they're so happy with what we provided to them. So what are some things that sales leaders. Can do to go wide and deep with their current customers where the renewal is not a question and referrals are just something that happened naturally based on how pleasant the experience is.

[00:27:01] Right? So you've heard this before Colin selling is a team sport. These days, there is no such thing as a lone Wolf sales person anymore, or they're out there on their own. Look, you think about it sending one person out to close a multi. Million dollar deal to being sold to a multi-billion dollar company.

[00:27:21] Like, no, that's not going to work by any stretch of the imagination. Okay. For those of you who it is working for, how long will you keep doing it? But I don't know how sticky it is. And I don't know whether you get to expand, right? So it is a team sport. And especially in companies that are under a hundred million dollars in that 30 to $50 million range, where you're selling to these humongous companies, your CEO, your CFO, your CMO, your, you know, customer success team and people, your subject matter experts.

[00:27:53] Everybody is responsible for the customer. Everybody is responsible for the customer, the ops people who put the stuff in the box and get it there, or build it and ship it there. Or explain how to do it. You are all responsible for the customer. Every one of you. And if you don't believe it, then your company is probably not doing as well as it could be.

[00:28:15] Even know you might be blown it out of the water. You could be blown it out of the water. Even bigger. Everyone is responsible. So if you take a look at it that way and say, What does our customer need from us and how should we best interact with them? How can we provide them with what they need then that means that the salesperson is the ringleader orchestrating all of these relationships.

[00:28:39] I need this subject matter expert to talk to this person at the company. I need my sales leader to talk to this person. It's because they speak the same language. And they're going to talk about a different level of things than I'm talking about with this group of people. I need the people who make it work at my company to help the people who make it work at their company to know each other.

[00:28:59] I need my CEO. Okay. I'm a $50 million company. Maybe I don't get to. And to talk to the CEO of Ford motor company once again or something like that. But who's the highest ranking person that was involved in this decision that my CEO should touch base with and get to know and make sure that person knows that the CEO is available.

[00:29:21] When did so we have to really start to map out these relationships and build them out. So if you're just positioned with the people who made the decision for that particular sale and two or three of them go away away and often do their other thing. And now you're kind of with the people who are just at that operational level and you have no.

[00:29:41] Other relationships it's going to fall apart at some point. Yeah. And they have no idea why they even went with you in the first place. The people who made that decision are long gone and not involved anymore. No, one's maintaining a relationship with them. Now, once again, I do know salespeople who are good orchestrators and know how to do this.

[00:29:58] But when I said earlier, we may need to hire a different type of sales person and train them differently. This is what I mean, salespeople must be good orchestrators. They must be good at bringing people to consensus. They must be good at understanding the psychology of how people make decisions so they can see, Oh, I see.

[00:30:19] I see they're doubting this because this is where they are in the process and what they need is this to help them make a decision. So for example, at some point I might have two, three or four buyers on the line who are not quite sure yet. And I might need to say to them, let's lay out the pros and cons.

[00:30:35] Let's start with do nothing. If you do nothing. What w you know, whatever ramifications to your organization for that. Okay, good. Now, if you've got you, you do this internally, you've got to, you know, maybe hire a few people, or you've got a team who can do it, but then they've got other projects. So what does that look like?

[00:30:54] All right. Great. Now you've got three companies outside of yours that can provide this for you. Choosing one of those, what's the ramification of that. So do nothing. Do it internally or choose an outside vendor. Let's just get that down. Now, if the answer is choose an outside vendor is the best choice.

[00:31:14] You've got three to choose from. How will you choose? What is the best way for you to make a decision? What are the factors, you know, and help them list those out. Now, if they don't end up choosing you because you don't fit all the factors. At least, you know that and you move on, you don't waste any more time on, on the sale waste any more of their time and you part ways gracefully.

[00:31:37] And they look at you as, Oh my gosh, I can't believe you helped me. And we didn't even choose you. And now next time they might choose you or they might introduce you or they move to a new company, as I said earlier, and then they bring you in then. So why not? Well, because sales people are not trained to do that.

[00:31:54] Yeah. And the interesting thing there is that. Even if you maybe are not the best fit or you, don't a hundred percent fit what they're looking for, but you're close enough and you go that deep and provide that level of expertise and helping them make a decision. There's a good chance you still could win.

[00:32:13] Yes. Just because of you, you showed the buyer that you're willing to meet them, where they are. You're willing to give them all of the options. You're competent enough to even talk about your competitors, which most people aren't. Right. And give them their options and help them navigate through this change, which is uncomfortable for them.

[00:32:33] Um, you know, there there's a good chance. Hey, you might not be a hundred percent what they're looking for, but if you're good enough and better than the status quo of what they have today, and you show that you care that much. There's a good chance. You still win that deal. Yeah. And I just want to say one caution Collins.

[00:32:48] I don't talk about my competitors because I don't know enough about them to say anything other than here are the three you're considering. Here's some questions you should ask each. And here's what you should know about each. I can only talk to my solution and I'm happy to answer any of those for you, right?

[00:33:06] If you want to point out that these are the factors you would need to. Consider in order to make a really good decision. If so many sellers are scared to even touch the subject at all, they just avoid it. Like, it's not like, like that's not being talked about internally. They, you know, and, and so, you know, and it shows a level of confidence that, you know, and, and, and maybe help them, help them think about an option.

[00:33:32] Maybe they hadn't considered. That's not you. Right. They have so much pressure on them. You really can't blame the sales person when they haven't been trained properly to, they don't have the knowledge. Right. Experience in many cases and three, they have tremendous pressure on them to just get the deal closed.

[00:33:48] Right. So I can't really blame the salespeople at all. Who do I blame? I blame the CEO of the organization who is allowing. These behaviors to continue allowing them to make thousands of calls and thousands of emails to people who don't answer the phone or don't respond to emails and allowing them to continue.

[00:34:12] To use these methods that are not working and not, uh, having their sales leaders train their salespeople differently, not bringing in day in the life of the buyer type of activities. I blame the CEO. They want more sales and yet they don't know how to support their sales organization very well. I mean, some of them do of course, and we're seeing amazing growth in some of these companies, but some of them are just growing in spite of themselves because they have a product that everybody needs.

[00:34:41] Um, and so people are buying it, but that is only gonna last for so long. It's not necessarily sustainable. So I think if we all can think about running organizations that are good for. People good for the world, you know, just kind benevolent, wonderful organizations. Then we can wrap our head around, serve the customer.

[00:35:08] That's what we're here to do. How do we best do that? Reset your entire sales organization around that and watch what happens. Yeah, Alice, this has been a lot of fun talking about this. Uh, really appreciate you coming on, enjoyed this topic. Any final thoughts? What are we gonna drop in the show notes for our sales hustlers to find out more about what you're doing?

[00:35:33] All that good stuff. Well, I have several great events coming up. I won't tell you all about them now, but I will get the links to you so we can drop those in and Collin, as you know, I'm launching my own podcast. So I can rant some more. If you, if you want to listen to my rantings, I'm going to be interviewing CEOs of companies in the 10 to $100 million range who are not startups, but more mature companies.

[00:36:02] And those CEOs are going to tell us. About how they built their sales organizations and how they stay involved in sales, what things they will do, what things they won't do and how they make sure that sales has the support needed to really do the kinds of things that you and I have been talking about today.

[00:36:21] Yeah. And when that is live, we will drop the link in there for the show notes as well. Alice, thanks so much for coming on. If you enjoy today's episode, write us a review, share it with your friends and as always we're listening for your feedback. Yeah. And please connect with me on LinkedIn. Let me know.

[00:36:37] You heard me here on Collin's show and I will accept your connection request immediately, and I'd be happy to answer any questions. Awesome. We'll drop that in the show notes as well. Sales hustlers. Thanks so much for tuning in. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of sales hustle. Are you a sales professional looking to take your sales career to the next level?

[00:36:57] If the answer is yes, then I want you to go over to. Sales check us out. And if you feel that you are ready, set up a time to talk with me and my co-founder Chris, I'm your host collum Mitchell. And if you enjoyed this episode, feel free to leave us a review and share the podcast with your friends.