Sales Hustle is now Sales Transformation
Feb. 19, 2021

Episode #61 S1-EP61 Hire Great Reps And Optimize Sales Teams with David Masover

Collin Mitchell welcomes David Masover to the Sales Hustle Podcast. Before digging into sales, David shares a little background about himself and how he started in sales. He shares tactical tips in the areas of Sales Process that are helpful to up your sales game.


David Masover is B2B Sales Accelerator at David Masover Sales Consulting. He helps sales teams unlock and scale up the sales potential of their entire team. He is a Podcast host of the shows “The CEO Sales Insights Podcast” and “The Driving B2B Sales Revenue Podcast.”

David is also an Author, Consultant, and Coach. His books "The Salesman's Guide to Dating,” "Mastering Your Sales Process," and "Managing the Sales Process" all embody the essence of a lot of the work that he does with his private coaching and consulting clients. He captures the lessons learned in his career and through the efforts to improve his peers, staff, trainees, and clients.

You can learn more about David Masover and connect with him on the following links below.

If you’re listening to the Sales Hustle podcast, please subscribe, share, and we’re listening for your feedback. If you are a sales professional looking to take your sales career to the next level, please visit us at https://salescast.co/ and set a time with Collin and co-founder Chris.

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Transcript

Episode 61 - David Masover

Collin Mitchell: [00:00:00] Welcome to the sales hustle. The only no BS podcast, where we bring you the real raw uncut experiences from sales change makers across various industries. The only place where you can get what you're looking for too. Uh, your sales game today's episode is brought to you by sales cast sales cast helps sales professionals transform the relationship building process and win their dream clients.

[00:00:30] I'm your host, Colin Mitchell. All right. What is happening? Sales hustlers. Welcome to another episode. I've got a fantastic guest today that I met on LinkedIn David mass. Over he is a consultant coach podcast, host and author, and is a fanatic about sales process, which we're going to dig into today. Uh, David, welcome to the show.

[00:00:55] David Masover: [00:00:55] Thanks man. You know, I'm happy to be here, but there's something very, not sexy about being a fanatic about sales process. Don't you think? I mean, there's, it's hard to be cool when you're described that way, but I, I get what you mean. Cool. 

[00:01:06] Collin Mitchell: [00:01:06] If you're a sales nerd, like maybe me and you, then that sounds like, wow.

[00:01:12] Fanatic about sales process. He sounds really cool and interesting maybe for your audience that works. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe for your average, I dunno person, non salesperson. Um, they might be like, Oh, that sounds like talking about accounting or something. Well, let's go with it then. Yeah. Yeah. Hey, so thanks for coming on.

[00:01:31] Appreciate it. Um, and before we dive into the tactical stuff, um, just give us the short version of your sales story. Yeah. 

[00:01:41] David Masover: [00:01:41] Sure. So when I tell the short version, I tell people that I got my first sales job in 1991 and they all grown because that was a long time ago. And they think there's going to be a whole lot there, but, but it's actually pretty relevant because at my first sales job, I was terrible.

[00:01:55] I mean, I just had no idea what I was doing. I, you know, it was two days worth of bad product training. And then there's your phone? There's the list of the person we just fired. There's Mary over there, give her your orders and you know, good luck. I had no idea what to do. Just none. I, it was the open office and I heard people laughing and joking.

[00:02:13] And then at the end of their conversations, they were getting orders. And I just had no idea how they did that. And, um, you know, the, the way that I dealt with that, but I didn't quit. I, the way I tell the story now is, is I invented the sales process. I, I learned later that somebody else had already done that a long time before I did, but I didn't really understand how to get sales, but I thought to myself, listen, what if I break it down?

[00:02:36] You know, who should I be contacting? And why should they bother talking to me? And, and you know, what problem am I solving for them? And what should I say when I first get in touch with them? And you know, I'm not going to go through every day since 1991, but the fact of the matter is. That basic approach has served me really well for 30 years as a salesperson, as a manager, as an executive, as a, as a.com startup co-founder back in the, in the web 1.0 era back in Silicon Valley.

[00:03:05] As a coach, as a consultant, as an author, it all comes down to this, you know, let's ask those basic simple questions about what is it that we're doing and how can we do it better and how can we connect it better? And, uh, you know, that's kind of the backdrop behind pretty much everything in the 30 year career that I've had in sales, which I've really enjoyed.

[00:03:25] So it's worked out pretty well. 

[00:03:26] Collin Mitchell: [00:03:26] Mm. Okay. And it's, it's funny, cause I actually listened to a podcast that you were on and, uh, and heard that stories and, and I have very similar story, very, very similar story. It was just, you know, give your, your orders to Lisa. Um, and it was same deal. Here's a name, here's a phone, don't use the CRM, it doesn't work.

[00:03:46] Um, and here's the script and it was a very, you know, transac, transactional sort of script. And it was, you know, make an offer. Make another offer, change the subject, make another offer. If you don't get an order, you better get a commitment for a future. Um, and you know, and I would just kind of pick up things that people were saying that were putting numbers on the board somewhere.

[00:04:09] Some of the things we're good, some of the things were not good. Somebody came along and told me, Hey, you shouldn't be saying that. I'm like, Hey, but he's saying it over there. And he seems to be putting a lot of numbers up on the board. Yeah. But it's not true. And I'm like, Oh, okay. Um, and then I kinda went on this quest of.

[00:04:23] You know, finding my own way and learning and listening to podcasts and books and blogs and following people. Um, so tell me a little bit about creating your own sales process. W w w what did you know for somebody who maybe doesn't have a process or hasn't been taught a process? Like, where does somebody start.

[00:04:41] Yeah, I think 

[00:04:41] David Masover: [00:04:41] these days it's allowed to use Europe, you know, back in 1991, uh, you know, I had audio tapes. I didn't even know they existed. That actually turned things around for me. Cause one of the people at this, this company took pity on me and she gave me Brian Tracy's psychology of selling on audio cassette, which is a fantastic book or audio.

[00:05:01] If you listen to it, probably not the one to start with it's a little bit advanced. It was kind of over my head. But, you know, it, it opened my eyes to the fact that, Hey, there's people out there who write about this stuff and talk about this stuff. And I think that, that it can be intimidating to think about this idea of, I need to create a process.

[00:05:18] So. And when I look back at how I approached this problem at the beginning of my sales career, I didn't know, approach it as a process. It later, you know, it, it, I realized that's what it was, but I thought to myself, yeah, I'm not good at cold calling. How can I get good at cold calling? And I found an audio book program and it sucked.

[00:05:38] And I found a book and it sucked. And I went to a lecture and it sucked. And then I found one that was pretty good. And so I stuck with it and then I refined it and then I got better at it. And then I got real busy. And I'm like, okay, how can I manage my time better? And I started, you know, same thing. So when you have a problem in front of you, you know, try to go really deep on that problem.

[00:05:57] And then at some point, step back a little bit and say, okay, I've got all these little pieces. How do I put them together? And that's effectively what a process is. And I think that's, uh, that's a, a reasonable way to approach something that's complex by just breaking it down into simple pieces, figuring out the pieces and then figuring out how they fit together.

[00:06:17] Collin Mitchell: [00:06:17] Um, there's, there's one thing that really stood out to me and what you said there, so on your quest to get better at cold calling, which I love, I love cold calling. I enjoy cold calling. Most people hate it. Um, as a founder, I still cold call five hours a week. Um, And I just like being in the trenches and leading by example.

[00:06:36] But what you said is, so as an, in your quest to, to, to get better at cold calling, you know, you read a book, you had a tape, you went to a lecture and they all sucked, but you didn't give up. He didn't give up. Yeah. Um, and, and, and, and I think it's so easy for a lot of people these days to, you know, try to get better at something maybe it's hire coach or read a book or whatever, and things don't change and to, to give up what was it that made you so determined to like continue seeking knowledge of, of, you know, getting better at that one piece of your process?

[00:07:09] Cold calling. 

[00:07:11] David Masover: [00:07:11] I, it was really the only way I knew how to reach out to other businesses. I mean, at the time I wasn't inclined to drive around in my car and knock on doors. I had done that in a previous job and it just didn't seem very efficient given the kind of things we were selling. I was selling. Uh, so this first job, it was great.

[00:07:27] It was, it was. Pure commodity consumer, uh, computer supplies. So computer consumables, disks, and ribbons and toner cartridges, you know, the kind of stuff that's exactly the same from everybody else. And so, you know, and everybody uses this stuff, so you really just have to reach out to a lot of people and try to find somebody that you connected to.

[00:07:47] So cold calling at the time. Was the most efficient and effective. This was 91 people that weren't using emails so much. There wasn't the internet. So cold calling was kind of it. And I knew if I was going to get good at this job, I had to get good at cold calling. So it was either get good at that or give up.

[00:08:03] And I really wasn't inclined to give up. So, so I worked at him. 

[00:08:06] Collin Mitchell: [00:08:06] Um, so I think that's an important piece. Is, is it takes a lot of. Hard work. It takes a lot of, you know, being willing to invest time in your development. And sometimes if you're not getting the support inside your organization, it's, it's your responsibility as a seller to make sure you get better at your craft and not just say, Hey, you know, there's no training here.

[00:08:31] You know, I'm not learning, I'm not getting better. There's no support. There's if you want to get better, it's it's on you to go out and get it. Now, some are fortunate to maybe work inside of an organization where there is a lot of support, but it's not that uncommon where there's not. And I definitely believe that it's the seller's responsibility to go out and make sure that they get better at their craft.

[00:08:52] If they're not getting the support that they need. 

[00:08:55] David Masover: [00:08:55] Absolutely. It's, it's a huge source of frustration for me that, that I see so many organizations where there is no support and because of the nature of my work, I see that a lot. And you know, when people ask me about my, why I tell the same story, you know, my, why is I remember clearly staring at that phone in 1991.

[00:09:13] And it was a very bad feeling. And I remember those first cold calls and it was horrible and uncomfortable and frustrating. And, you know, I think it's really a shame, the degree to which so many organizations don't support their salespeople. But as you said, it's a reality and those people who do wind up kind of figuring out sales most I know who were successful in sales really love the fact that they hung in there.

[00:09:40] They stuck it out. They got good at this craft. It's not only financially rewarding when you're successful, but when you're doing it right. And you look at the job as helping people solve problems, it can be very rewarding and all kinds of different ways. So yeah, hanging in there is great. It's a shame that.

[00:09:56] That so many have too, but this stuff isn't rocket science. It takes work. But if you work at it, you'll get better. And, uh, yeah, I think it's great when I see people who have the initiative to do so. 

[00:10:07] Collin Mitchell: [00:10:07] Okay. All right. So, so you, you, you, the first step was getting better at cold calling. The next step was getting better at managing your time.

[00:10:15] Let's talk a little bit about that. What, what mistakes were you making? What improvements did you make? You know, what did you learn? In managing your time better as a seller. And how does, how is that, why is that so important as part of the process? No, that's a lot of questions, but 

[00:10:29] David Masover: [00:10:29] let's dig into it. It's a, it's a throwback down memory lane.

[00:10:32] So it took me a while to get really, really good at cold calling. And part of it was, was cold calling and part of it was targeting. I left the computer supplies job. And I wound up getting a job in the promotional products, industry, you know, stuff with logos on it, which is actually a really fun business.

[00:10:46] Especially if you stop thinking about the stuff and start thinking about what people do with it. Um, but you know, again, there was no training for me and I didn't know who to target, so it took me a while to figure out, okay, who should I be calling? And once I figured that out, and once I got really good at it, I, I was like a machine I would come in and at three days a week I would work in the office two days on the road.

[00:11:09] And for 90 minutes, just 90 minutes, I would hammer the phones and set appointments and set appointments and set appointments. And after six months in that. I had too many clients and too many, too many orders and too much business. And now I'm like, okay, so this is a problem. It's a positive problem, but it's a problem.

[00:11:26] And when I recognize 

[00:11:27] Collin Mitchell: [00:11:27] I am good problem, I 

[00:11:29] David Masover: [00:11:29] listen, I wasn't complaining, but I think a lot of salespeople will relate to this. When you work so hard to get a client relationship, you do not want anything to fall through the cracks. You want to do everything you can to make sure that every order goes the way it's supposed to, or, you know, whatever.

[00:11:46] Project or program or deployment, whatever it is that you sell. Right. And, and what I recognized was I wasn't doing a great job of targeting. So I was just kind of calling everybody. And when I did some analysis, it's a big word. Right. I kind of looked at the spreadsheet, right. I did some analysis on my client base and I realized there's a lot of really small customers who aren't buying a lot.

[00:12:08] There's a lot of customers who are, who are, um, Let's say the, the, the, the ratio between the revenue they generated. And the amount of time I had to spend with them was, was not very conducive to success. So I, I did this thing. I can't remember where I read about it, but, um, that's when I discovered the Pareto principle, the 80 20 rule, and I took my client base into a spreadsheet and I ranked it by revenue.

[00:12:33] And I, I did the calculation and I drew a line at 20, at 80%, you know, who, you know, who's generating 80% of my revenue. And in my case, it was about 35% of my clients. And then I looked at the people below the line and I said, who do I really not like working with? And who's just. Really not, you know, who's taking more time than they should complaining a lot, not paying their bills, you know, arguing about everything.

[00:12:59] And I didn't know what to do with them because I didn't want to fire them. Cause I was too young and you know, not, not confident enough to do that, but I just kind of didn't respond as quickly to their stuff and, you know, raised my prices and. There was a lot of people you could buy promotional products from.

[00:13:15] So, but just being deliberate about asking that question, you know, who, who am I selling to and who should I be selling to and who should I be targeting? What was a really big step for me? 

[00:13:24] Collin Mitchell: [00:13:24] Yeah, no, I think that's a, a great exercise that all the sales hustlers out there should do. If they haven't is take a look at your, the people you're serving that you're selling to.

[00:13:35] And maybe there's some that can just over time, maybe go away to free you up to spend more time on those targeted accounts that are going to make a majority of your revenue. And, you know, as a seller, You pretty much should, or I would assume can read people pretty well, you know, and, and you can usually early on in, in sales discussions, or even in prospecting, find out, you know, is this, is this the, the discoveries as much as for you as it is for them?

[00:14:06] You know, is this somebody I want to work with? Is this somebody that's gonna maybe just always beat me up on price? Always compare me to some other vendor. Doesn't really value me or what I do, and just suck a lot of my time. You know, you know, those people in there are pretty easy to identify and it's totally okay to say, Hey, we're not, this is not a, you know, this is not an ideal fit.

[00:14:31] And you know, they'll find somebody else who maybe is for them. Um, but those are the ones that are going to take 80% of your time and only make up 20% of yours. 

[00:14:41] David Masover: [00:14:41] Right. Yeah, but the idea of being proactive about that. So my, my exercise was reactive where you're talking about is something that I've come to call mutual qualification, right?

[00:14:50] Qualification is a two way street. And obviously you want to learn from the client. What you need to learn, they should also be qualifying you, but that's definitely a two-way street. And, you know, at some point in everybody's business, all business is good business. And at some point it's about kind of protecting your time and making sure that you're, you're, you're also treated with respect and you're valued.

[00:15:13] And, uh, and, and as you grow in sales, I think that that should become. Excuse me, that should become more and more important. 

[00:15:20] Collin Mitchell: [00:15:20] Hm. Okay. So, so through this journey of, of, of creating your own sales process here, Sarah, just to kind of recap a little bit, right? It was cold calling time management. And then, and then really just looking at that 80 20 role and figuring out who are the best, you know, uh, after, after getting better at cold calling and just being committed to that.

[00:15:39] And spending 90 minutes on the phone every day for six months, and then being overwhelmed with the amount of clients and prospects that you had to deal with. And then, so it was almost just organically. It's like now I got to figure out how to manage, manage this a little bit better. Um, and so after you did that, then, then what?

[00:15:57] David Masover: [00:15:57] Yeah. You know, it's, it's, it's, I love this journey. It's a great set of questions because then, then you kind of get to a point where, okay, I'm getting into meetings. How can I maximize the effectiveness of those meetings? Right. And, and now, uh, you know, you would call that discovery or you might call that demo, which hopefully isn't just a demo.

[00:16:16] There's hopefully a little bit of discovery baked into that, but it's this whole idea of, you know, if you think about sales, it, it, it's kind of like, okay, who, who should I be reaching out to? How am I going to reach out to them? What am I going to do once we're in a conversation? And then how do I move that towards an agreement to do business together or not?

[00:16:32] And I think that, that, that, that third part, you know, what are we going to do when we're in the longer conversation? Uh, to me that's the hardest sales. I mean, obviously there's a lot of work that goes into getting into that conversation. So 

[00:16:45] Collin Mitchell: [00:16:45] what are some areas that you can focus on in to try to improve that part of your sales process?

[00:16:51] Like what are some common things that, you know, need some tweaking, uh, or you see that sellers can do better? 

[00:16:59] David Masover: [00:16:59] Yeah. Great question. So there's a couple of things that the number one problem that I see is problem. People are spending too much time talking about product, talking about what they sell, talking about features and benefits.

[00:17:11] Yeah. This stuff is written about too. Death. And yet when I work with salespeople and I work with sales organizations, uh, they're just not doing it. Right. You know, nobody cares about you and your stuff. Nobody cares about your process. Nobody cares about your awards or your websites or your tech. What they care about is here's the problem that I need to solve.

[00:17:30] How can you help me? And if you want to be successful in sales, whether you're just trying to get into that conversation or have the conversation effectively. It has to be focused on what's going on with you and how can I help? And once you get that orientation, right, then it's really about being able to have a conversation where it is focused on the other person or the other organization and their problems, but there's kind of an art to weaving in.

[00:18:00] Your credibility and your solution in a way that it, it, it, it feels like an organic part of the conversation, and it's a little more subtle in terms of, of something. I try to help teach people or coach people on. But I think when you start to get to that level and the discovery conversation feels like a conversation that's focused on the other person, but you're still establishing your credibility and the effectiveness of your solution.

[00:18:26] That's really where you want to be. 

[00:18:29] Collin Mitchell: [00:18:29] And, and what's interesting is I love this topic because, I mean, like you said, there's so many people talking about this, right. Stop talking about features and benefits and awards and accolades and all of that and logos. Right. And so many people in sales hear this, but it's like, they really don't get it.

[00:18:46] They don't really get it because they, they, they hear it. And they think that there may be not doing that. But they are still talking about product, talking about features and not really even being able to really, I mean, why, why is that? Why is that? And I see it all the time and especially when people are trying to pitch me.

[00:19:09] Right. Um, and, and so, yeah. Why is it so hard for a lot of sellers to get more into that like mode of just identifying, like, is there a problem, does the prospect value solving that problem? And are we the right fit to solve that problem? Why is it so hard to get the talk tracks more focused in that direction?

[00:19:31] David Masover: [00:19:31] I, I don't, I don't think I have a definitive answer for that. I don't, I'm not sure anybody does. I have an opinion. Um, I think part of it is, is. People just aren't taught people don't know what to do. Uh, so, so that's kinda the first problem if you will. Uh, but, but the second part of it is, is I think there's a confidence issue.

[00:19:52] Uh, I think that when you are really confident about your ability as a sales person, Just, just kind of the technical aspects of this job and what it is that we're supposed to be doing as we're, as we're engaging with customers and prospects. And, and, and if you have a certain level of acumen about business in general and the solution that you provide, then I think you're in a place where.

[00:20:13] You can really go in and sit down and have this conversation. But if you're not confident about those things, it's more comfortable to default to these very, very concrete things that, you know, we won this award and we did this thing and we have this logo it's I bit my own theory. Right. But I think it's just more psychologically safe.

[00:20:33] To talk about those more concrete things when you're not as confident about some of the more subtle and difficult to get your arms around elements of what it is that we're supposed to be doing out there in the field. 

[00:20:44] Collin Mitchell: [00:20:44] Yeah, no, I think that's a pretty, pretty damn good opinion about the, about the . Um, and I think it makes a lot of sense.

[00:20:53] Um, and I think also part of the problem is, is like there's no script for the perfect discovery. Like it's a collaborative conversation and you need to be properly armed and educated and confident. To have those sorts of discussions, right? There's no silver bullet of like, here's how you do it. And it's very easy to just fall back on this.

[00:21:14] Very like, And not, not treat it like a discovery and treat it more like a, you know, banter, qualification call, like, Hey, you know, how many users do you have? Do you have this? Do you have that? What CRM are you using? Like, and just get into that, you know, survey question mode of before you pass over to the AEE.

[00:21:30] Um, and so I think, you know, just. Look, what you said, being confident enough, having enough business acumen or knowing really strongly what your product does, what problems it solve, what those problems really mean for your ideal clients and being able to have a, just an educated conversation of like, Hey, you know, do you have this problem?

[00:21:51] Do you care about solving this problem in. Are we the right fit to solve that problem for you? Um, it's just a different type of, it's a collaborative conversation. There's no script for that. 

[00:22:02] David Masover: [00:22:02] Yeah. And it, it's interesting right now, uh, I'm in the middle of a project with, with a relatively new client. And, and I was just thinking about this, walking the dog this morning, that, you know, every time we go to a meeting we've had, we've kind of three big meetings so far.

[00:22:15] And, and every time I go in, it's like, I have some ideas about where I think we are. And we're going to talk about those, but by the end of the meeting, we have a little bit more information and it's like, okay, so we're going to have to change the direction. And I think the idea that, that, that I'm able to go in without an agenda, like, I'm not really trying to push, I can do this for you.

[00:22:35] I can do that for you. I can't do anything for you. I should, you know, send you over there. I'm not sure. I'm really just trying to figure that out. I think it's fostering the kind of conversation that's eventually going to get us to a place where if we agree on doing something together, we're all going to feel really good about it.

[00:22:50] And in my case that that could be a nice lucrative contract and not everybody has the luxury of that much flexibility in what they sell, but that general idea of. Let's just really figure out if there's a match in here based on what's going on with you. Um, that's a really solid way to enter into a conversation and you might find out, listen, we're not a good fit and that's okay.

[00:23:13] It's much better to just kind of realize that early and move on that than to try to fit a round peg into a square hole and wind up, making everybody uncomfortable at some point down the 

[00:23:23] Collin Mitchell: [00:23:23] road. Yeah. And, and, and that's a really important point there. So listen, sales house sellers, because it's so easy to assume, like everybody should work with you or everybody needs my product.

[00:23:36] And that, then you go into that. Relationship or conversation with a pretty closed mind. And I would suggest, you know, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. David is going into those conversations really with more of an open mind, like, Hey, I have no idea if it makes sense for us to work together, but let's just have a brief conversation and figure that out together.

[00:23:59] David Masover: [00:23:59] Yeah, absolutely. And there's another kind of, uh, there's a corollary concept of that that I think is really valuable and it's it's know what you do and know what you don't do and be clear about what you don't do, because I think if you, if you walk into a conversation and you know, everything, the prospect says, Oh yeah, yeah, we can do that.

[00:24:15] Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. We're really good at that. You know, it's probably not true. It probably doesn't come across as well as you think it doesn't, it's not very confidence inspiring on the other hand, When, when, when you come in, is that, you know, we, we don't do this and we don't do that almost by implication.

[00:24:32] What you're saying is, but we're really good at this other thing. And I think that's very confidence inspiring. It's hard to pull off if you're not confident, but if you are, I think you exude that confidence and that, that, that makes it very good. Kind of a, a lubricant for the, uh, uh, for more friction-free sale.

[00:24:49] Collin Mitchell: [00:24:49] Yeah. Yeah. And it, and it, and it shows a level of vulnerability and confidence as a seller, that's going to help you build rapport early on. Absolutely. So there's so many benefits to that. Um, all right. So, so, so let's talk about what's what's next in, in the process. Um, after, you know, we talked about cold calling time management, um, you know, Discovery demo, improving that process, then what, 

[00:25:18] David Masover: [00:25:18] well, you know, the classic sales process are the, you know, the one that I wrote about in my books is, you know, leads, prospecting, qualification, discovery, and then you got kind of the backend, uh, proposals, objections, and closing.

[00:25:29] What I learned as I, as I worked this process was, you know, there's seven steps there. Right? What I learned is there really ought to just before. Um, they really are to just before, because if you're doing discovery properly, all, ultimately what you want to be doing is co collaborating on a proposal. You really want to be having a discussion with the end of the discussion.

[00:25:52] You almost instantly get to a very soft close, which sounds something like. Yeah. So this makes sense to me. What about you or yeah. You know, what's the next step forward or, yeah, I should write up the paperwork on this because you've already agreed on everything as a part of the discovery conversation. I think a big mistake, a lot of salespeople make is they go into discovery with their checklist of questions.

[00:26:14] They check the boxes, they run back to their office and they're like, okay, I'm going to send them a quote or, okay, I'm going to send them the thing. And you've kind of lost all the mojo at that point. You know, because all of a sudden you're on, you're on two different sides of this equation. If you can really have the right kind of discovery conversation, you remain a team with the prospect, solving a problem, coming up with a solution, moving it forward.

[00:26:38] Uh, so you know, my seven step sales process, uh, Pretty quickly became a four step sales process and you know what? Yeah, you do have to write up a proposal and there might be some questions. And, you know, you do have to kind of sometimes nudge them to make sure that we get this thing finalized, but, but the balance of the effort really has to happen in terms of getting into the right conversation with the right people, having the right conversation when you do.

[00:27:03] And if you do those things right, you know, the back half of the sales process ought to be pretty easy. Barring anything unforeseen, which happens, but it ought to be pretty easy in most cases. 

[00:27:13] Collin Mitchell: [00:27:13] Yeah. Yeah. I, I love that answer. Um, and, and I do believe, you know, that. A lot of, you know, closing the sale happens early on.

[00:27:23] And if it's done properly and being mindful of like, you know, don't just let everybody in your pipeline, like B protect your pipeline, you know, are these people that genuinely have a problem that I can fix? Have we had a collaborative enough, you know, discussion where they value solving that, you know, taking.

[00:27:42] Crazy ridiculous notes and there's technology that helps this, you know, it makes it a little easier for you. Um, so that you have everything that you are armed with too. You know, if you get a little pushback, you can remind them of those things that you discussed and why it's important to move forward.

[00:27:56] Um, and so I love that answer any. David as, as, as we start to wrap it up here, any final thoughts? Um, anything else you want to let the sales hustlers know and then tell them where they can find out more about you, your podcast, your books, whatever else, wherever you want to send them that we'll include in the show notes.

[00:28:14] Yeah. 

[00:28:15] David Masover: [00:28:15] You know, I, I don't know. Nothing's popping to mind other than, you know, sales has been a really great career for me. And, and I think that when I reflect back on the 30 year career, that I. You know, I'd still like to keep going. I've got a lot of juice left and I'm not done yet, but you know, I there's challenges.

[00:28:33] And I think that sales is not only a really great profession, but when you embrace the challenges, it becomes like, like so many other things where you embrace the challenge. There's an opportunity for personal growth. And it's very easy to think about sales as this kind of transactional thing where it's volume and velocity and throwing lots of stuff against the wall and, you know, hustling as you're, as you're.

[00:28:56] As your podcast name implies, but, but there's also kind of a bigger game in there and there's, there's really, you know, who am I and how am I doing this and who am I as a sales professional? And I think keeping that in the back of your mind is not only going to help you remain sane, especially during the tough times, but, but it gives you a bigger picture and, and some motivation to keep moving forward.

[00:29:17] Especially when things get a little bit tough and you know what they do for everybody. So don't kid yourself about that either. 

[00:29:22] Collin Mitchell: [00:29:22] Yeah. Yeah, no, I totally agree. And so tell folks where they can find your books, learn more about you. Anything else you want to 

[00:29:29] David Masover: [00:29:29] share with them? Yeah, thanks. I, so I Googled pretty well.

[00:29:33] David, just like David mass over M a S O V E R, just like Passover, but just one S and starts with an M th there's another guy named David mass over, uh, I'm starting to edge him out on Google. He he's young, he's got a beard, he's an atheist and any, and he talks about that on YouTube a lot. So if you run across that guy, I'm not him.

[00:29:51] No most of my stuff is going to be sales and sales related, but you can find me on LinkedIn. I post most, every day there, uh, Google, Amazon, uh, or at my website, David mass, over.com. 

[00:30:03] Collin Mitchell: [00:30:03] Awesome. We'll include the link that, uh, for that in the show notes, everybody, if you're listening to the podcast and you enjoy today's episode, write us a review, share it with your friends, and we're always listening for your feedback.

[00:30:15] Thank you for tuning in to this episode of sales hustle. Are you a sales professional? Looking to take your sales career to the next level. If the answer is yes, then I want you to go over to sales, cast.com, check us out. And if you feel that you are ready, set up a time to talk with me and my co-founder Chris, I'm your host column Mitchell.

[00:30:38] And if you enjoyed this episode, feel free to leave us a review and share the podcast with your friends.