Sales Hustle is now Sales Transformation
Dec. 2, 2020

Episode #27 S1-EP27 Fill Your Sales Funnel with Kevin Hopp

Kevin Hopp joins Collin Mitchell in this episode of the Sales Hustle Podcast. Kevin shares a little background about himself, and he tells us how he got into sales. He is the “Cold Calling Evangelist,” and Kevin shares nothing but tactical outbound sales to help listeners up your sales game.

Kevin Hopp is the VP of Sales Development at SalesGig. SalesGig is an outsourced, fractional to full-time, sales development organization built to support our B2B clients. They deploy proven outbound cold call strategies to help our client expand reach, open conversations, and create robust sales funnels to accelerate sales results.

He is also a member of Modern Sales Pros and RevGenius. Kevin is also a Principal at Hopp Consulting Group. 

You can connect with Kevin Hopp on his LinkedIn at He would be happy to do a 15-minute cold-calling script review/tips/tricks session with anyone. If your organization needs to grow, check Kevin and SalesGig at

If you’re listening to the Sales Hustle podcast, please subscribe, share, and we’re listening for your feedback. If you are a sales professional looking to take your sales career to the next level, please visit us at and set a time with Collin and co-founder Chris.

Join Our Sales Motivational SMS list by texting Hustle to 424-378-6966. Please make sure to rate and review the show on Apple. 

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Episode 27

Welcome to the sales hustle. The only no BS podcast, where we bring you the real raw uncut experiences from sales makers across various industries. The only place where you can get what you're looking for too. Uh, your sales game today's episode is brought to you by sales cast sales cast helps sales professionals transformed the relationship building process and win their dream clients.

[00:00:30] I'm your host, Colin Mitchell. All right. What's happened in sales hustlers. Welcome to another episode. I've got a fantastic guests. We've just been sitting here, chopping it up for a long time, forgot to hit record and been having a ton of fun. I have Kevin hop. He's a cold calling evangelist, and we're going to jump in.

[00:00:47] You're going to learn a little bit about his story, and then we're going to talk nothing but tactical outbound sales so that you can up your sales game sales hustlers, Kevin, welcome to the show. How are you doing? I'm doing great. Thanks for having me on. Appreciate it con yeah. Yeah, man. All right. So tell us how you got into sales and a little bit about your story and keep it short because we want to keep it as tactical as possible.

[00:01:11] Yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, it's open page one of a thousand page book here and started reading slowly. Just kidding. I've been in sales for going on six years here. Um, I got into sales just because my first job out of college, I was working at a startup. I was the only employee of the first employee at a seed stage startup.

[00:01:33] So I had to do like everything, right. And if you do everything, you start to think about like, well, can I go do this job again somewhere else? And it's like, kinda not really the, you know, Jack of all trades the King of none, right? That's the classic mistake that a lot of young people make is they become a Jack of all trades.

[00:01:51] Uh, but the longer you go being a Jack of all trades, you need to go like found a company or something, but you can't go make a lot of money. Um, in any one given role. So I, I, you know, thought about it and was like, well, what am I going to make the most money doing that I'm actually good at? And it was sales.

[00:02:09] So I got to an SDR job at a different tech startup. Um, after that first startup went under and then, uh, rode the wave there. Like I think every sales person should work for a SAS, uh, startup at some point that raises venture capital. Because, Oh boy, it's a really fun experience, right? Like seeing your a CEO's like eyes get all bloodshot.

[00:02:35] After he walks out of a book board meeting where it's like, we need to triple sales overnight, we're going to spend $2 million at Dreamforce this year. We're going to agitate the market. Man brought in a sales consultant guy that kind of changed my life and taught me how to really cold call. And that was like, uh, you know, like any boiler room you've ever seen.

[00:02:57] We had a boiler room, no chairs allowed in the sales pit. Everyone had to stand up and make $150 a day. If you didn't have 20 live conversations with prospects that were verifiable through Salesforce, you had to stay late and call Australia. So you'd stay until seven o'clock at night. Calling spread sounds brutal.

[00:03:16] Ah, dude. That's I was, I was forged in a pit of fire. That's what I like to say about like my sales career. So, so, so tell me a little bit about that experience, right? Because some people thrive in that type of environment and others are like, this is horrible. This is abuse, like I'm outta here. So, so, so did you rise to the occasion and thrive in there?

[00:03:38] Or did you like, I gotta get the hell out of here. I dominated. Yeah. I really, really enjoyed it because, uh, you know, like all the stupid things they say about salespeople, I'm ultra competitive. Anyone that knows me will tell you that I'm super competitive. I'm athletic. I played high school football. Uh, I'm aggressive by nature.

[00:03:59] Um, all that stuff plays into who you have to be if you're gonna thrive in like, uh, like, uh, you know, doggy dog sales pit type area. Like this consultant came in and taped a hundred dollar bill up on the wall and said the first person to book a meeting, did I get that? You know, shit like that? Oh my God.

[00:04:17] You know, apparently our last time as fast as we can, like smashing the numbers on the phone, and this was no technology, this was literally all I had was a Mac book air. And a, uh, voice phone and that was it. So we had to smash numbers to get there. I did really well. Um, I ended up, uh, getting, let go from that company for other reasons, but Hey, um, you know, sales people get, let go.

[00:04:44] This turnover is, is, uh, turnover is real. And the longer I get into my career, the longer I'm I'm able to hang on to these roles, but I I'm also in these people that learn things the hard way. All right. So tell me some of the T tell me some of the main takeaways, like things that you learned in, in that environment that still stick with you today.

[00:05:02] Well, there's no, there's no substitute for raw hustle, right? There's no substitute for all hustle. Number one, number two. Um, the things that you dread the most about your job are probably the things you should get the best staff. Right. And that's kind of where I'm a glutton for punishment, and that's kind of where I've turned into this cold calling King, whatever you want to call me Evangel, or my nightmare is that people see my LinkedIn headline and think like, Oh, that's good.

[00:05:28] He's spreading the good, good news of Jesus Christ. He's an evangelist. I'm like, Oh no, you know, I, it's not, it's not a religious thing. I'm evangelical about the fact that everybody should be cold calling and it doesn't have to suck. Yeah. Yeah, no, I agree. And you know, like when you see these gurus are sales, coaches are like, never make a cold call again.

[00:05:47] I'm like why? That, that sounds like torture. Like, why would you want to take that away? Like. If you can get good at it, do it consistently and have fun. Why would you not want to do it? And it's the most efficient, most effective way to reach the most people and build relationships, which is all about what you need to do to drive sales.

[00:06:09] Yeah, absolutely. And you know, the idea that like cold calling is dead. Um, does every single person have a phone within two feet of them at all time? Yes. Great. Yeah, sure. I'll add you on LinkedIn and send you a DM. You're not gonna respond. Sure. I'll like it, the tweets you sent, but like for any STRs listening to this, every one of your buyers has one of these within three feet of them.

[00:06:33] Right now. I promise if not two, if not two, if it's not actually in their hand, it might be in their hand. So buzz that thing, man, like that's, that's the way to do it. Um, so. Fast forward. Uh, now, um, I, uh, I'm helping grow called sales gig and we do fractional outbound sales development. So not only am I a huge advocate for, um, you know, teaching outbound sales and teaching cold calling and, uh, thinking that people should be doing it more and often I'm a practitioner, right.

[00:07:08] And, uh, I consider myself kind of the best kind of leader I lead from the front. I have a team of eight full-time dialers. Uh, full-time STRs that it hit anywhere from four to 600 calls a day. You can have 30 to 50 brand new cold pressed. Every day we call them conversationalists because that's all my guys do.

[00:07:28] They don't spend time researching. They don't spend time fluxing around on LinkedIn or writing emails. Really. They spend their time talking. To people about business problems and valuable solutions, and that's how we deliver value for our growing client base. But so tell me how w tell me how, when they get a live person on the phone, how are they standing out?

[00:07:49] It what's making them different to be successful? Yeah, absolutely. Great, great, great question. You know, part of the, part of the secret sauce is not so secret, which is you have to understand who you're calling. And what they might potentially care about or what might potentially be an issue for them right.

[00:08:07] At the end of the day. No, this, every, every person, every sales person listening right now, before you pick up that phone to make that cold call, they're probably not interested and they have a solution in place today. So if you know that and we're comfortable with that before we pick up the phone, when they say, yeah, you know, I got a system that does that right now.

[00:08:27] Thanks, Kevin. Thanks for the call. Oh, no. Colin. That's actually the reason I was calling you, we know you have a solution in place today, and we'd like to show you how ours is different. And when people like you in your role as a VP of sales, as an owner, have sat down with us. They've been able to gain the following advantages.

[00:08:46] Right. So having a complete plan and not being surprised, I call it knowing your universe. Right. All right. So, but does this start with the list? Let's talk about the list. Let's talk about the list because knowing who you're calling, knowing that they're not interested, knowing that you're interrupting their day, knowing that they already have a solution.

[00:09:04] That's great. You overcome that, right. But how do you make sure you're calling the right people? To maximize the amount of conversations that you get to have on a daily basis. That's a really good question. So it does start with the list, right? And list building is something I am fanatical about, and I constantly talk about the quality of data because at the end of the day, STRs, can't pull blood from a stone, but give you a list ripped from zoom info of a thousand.

[00:09:30] It decision-makers. It's going to be like 35 to 40% garbage. Either the emails are getting around and see the phone numbers. Don't connect, change titles. The rate, the decay is only getting more. Yeah. Aggressive because now guess what? You don't have to like the it manager that worked at a company in Houston, Texas can now be an it manager for a company that's in Minnesota, because with COVID everybody's working from home.

[00:09:55] You don't have to live in the city where your businesses anymore. So we are finding in our business right now because we talked a lot of people, data decay is crazy. Like someone you find on LinkedIn working there two weeks ago, it doesn't work there anymore. So if we're going to start from square zero, like, you know, square one, how do I, how do I build a list to figure out who I want to talk to, to figure out who I can get into my sales pipeline?

[00:10:21] The first thing I would do if I'm a new SDR or a new sales rep in a territory is look at your most successful customers. Right. And it's a different question. If we're talking about like a pre-seed stage startup that like the whole market research thing, you kind of need to do and test multiple verticals and all that, if you're like pre-seed or pre, but if you're a post a or if you're walking into a role where people have had success in the past, don't reinvent the wheel, right.

[00:10:48] Like figure out who the decision makers were involved in these deals, by checking out the CRM, talking to the veteran reps, your VP of sales should supply things like this. Your sales managers should supply things like this and then going and getting these people's current information. Now the part that sucks that I'm just going to be honest with here.

[00:11:10] It takes time. It takes time and it takes money if you're going to do it right. Um, and this is it's going to be difficult for a lot of people, probably the, that are going to see and hear this. It's like, well, my sales manager won't invest in any tools. Right. Or we only have ZoomInfo or we only have lead IQ.

[00:11:28] Right. Um, as much as I think, uh, like Brandon Bornancin and the whole seamless, I, I, uh, thing is kind of crazy because he's trying to become like Gary V I don't know if you guys, if you know, Brandon Bornancin, but like yeah. He he's kind of wackadoodle, but his company gives away free leads. So every person here listening to this go make a seamless profile.

[00:11:49] You get like a hundred free cell phone numbers. A month. Lead IQ gives you like 10 free ones. Lucia gives you 15 free credits. There's ways to find this contact information. Um, and LinkedIn, of course, it's the greatest database in the world. Like go to go to LinkedIn, find these people, build a spreadsheet of all of them with LinkedIn in it and cross your fingers that you can prove a case to your boss that you need to pay to go get their contact information at.

[00:12:15] So for instance, at sales gig, I'm not going to talk in depth about how we do data, but we don't trust one source. Right? Absolutely not. We trust. We spread our risk across. Just tell me what does that look like? So without naming sources, without like giving away your secret sauce or whatever the case is of why you're protecting your process, um, one source is not going to be the solution.

[00:12:42] We get that. So are you running a list? Cross-checking it against other sources? What does that like? Just map. Yeah, so, I mean, Let's let's take it. Let's say it this way. If you go to just zoom info, just big database, look at it. In terms of there's big databases that are big aggregators, basically the niche ones, right?

[00:13:04] There's ones that focus on certain things and there's a lot of new ones that are popping up. That are like claiming to be the zoom info alternative for, you know, half the price or whatever. Right. Right. And there's, I love it by the way, competition is great for the consumer. We're the consumers here competition is going to drive prices down through the floor.

[00:13:24] Right. And we do a lot of that too. At sales gig, we just turn around and we take one data benders quote, and throw it in the other one's face. Right. Like matching her, beat it. Like, so then that's the nature of competition. Um, So on what that looks like. The problem is if you just go to big data, source a and pull out a big list of CEOs of tech companies, they probably gathered that data six months ago.

[00:13:48] Now it's sitting there, I advocate doing it the other way around where I want to go find the most up-to-date free information possible. LinkedIn, LinkedIn, go to LinkedIn and build your list off of LinkedIn. An amazing tool sales navigator. I'm sure everybody here has heard of it. You think it's expensive?

[00:14:08] It's expensive. Not to be able to build these lists like that. It's one of the best sales lead list makers in the world. And it only costs like 70 bucks a month or something 80 bucks a month. Right? Like I absolutely pay for that. I pay for that out of my own pocket. If I was a rep where my manager management didn't pay for it because.

[00:14:25] Your time is money, and you can build a lead list of people that just changed jobs or people that are in a certain role right now. So then step one, we're going to get rid of the fact that ZoomInfo said that Colin used to work at monster voice a year ago. Well, now I know he has a new job at sales CAS.

[00:14:43] Now I want to talk to Colin about sales casts. I don't want to talk to him about that. Right? So I'd start with LinkedIn. And then from LinkedIn, you have the most up-to-date okay. I've double checked with my eyes and hands that this person works here. I can go check it up against the database. And are you talking about doing this manually?

[00:15:02] Like minimally doing it? Like we don't, but uh, like the, you can get a virtual assistant. You can get some, I mean, like there's options to do a cheap, but it sounds like you're talking about going backwards, like creating the list manually from LinkedIn with the most current up-to-date. You know, his update is current as you're going to get and then, and then enriching it with the bigger, larger database.

[00:15:25] Yeah. Like I like P data sources. People think the data sources are like the Bible. It's like all the truth. It's like, no, they're, they're generally bad at most of that. What they are good at is aggregating the data. That's hard for us to get, which is. Their cell phone number, which is their absolute correct email address, stuff like that.

[00:15:44] But they're not going to be as instantly accurate as LinkedIn. Right? I change jobs tomorrow. I'm going to put it on LinkedIn. People are doing that now, right? Like it's becoming more bigger and bigger. And LinkedIn keeps changing the UI and adding all these silly Instagram like features. But it's cool as a sales person, if you don't spend half your day on LinkedIn, I don't know what you're doing.

[00:16:08] We'll be probably selling B to C, probably selling candy bars, being seller, be on LinkedIn. You gotta be all over it. By the way, you've got to build an audience, something like that. Right. Um, it's not enough just to be yourself and, and put that you're an SDR at a company and think that people will want to talk to you.

[00:16:24] Right. I'm a big advocate for, for build an audience on LinkedIn. So. Absolutely. And, and, and, you know, LinkedIn is a whole nother strategy that we can, we can dig into. Right. But, you know, not just connecting, but, you know, taking those conversations off the platform, actually, you know, adding value and building relationships.

[00:16:45] So many people just connect with people and do nothing. Or just lurk on the platform and don't comment, don't engage. Uh, you know, if there's somebody in your pipeline, like if they've made it that far in your selling process, LinkedIn should be part of your strategy of continuing to stay top of mind. And with that, Oh, a hundred percent, a hundred percent.

[00:17:05] And by the way, um, you know, the data has kind of shown, and this is not revolutionary that you don't need to personalize the invites. And when you use a tool to personalize the invites. People like me and others are getting ahead of that, where I have emojis in my name now. So if you ever sent me a non-personal lot, like a non handwritten note, I know, cause it shows phone, phone, Kevin phone phone, and I'm like, yeah, you need this duck soup or texted you or whatever.

[00:17:35] There's like a hundred of these LinkedIn now. I'm okay with I'm. Okay. With using tools to make connections. And create conversation, but it's all about how you use it, right? Like, are you using it to just connect with people and then take it offline and have a build a meaningful relationship? Or add value to that?

[00:17:57] Or are you using it to just like seek sit in a sequence? Like here can trick you into connecting with me saying something that hopefully peaks your interest and then if it doesn't, I'm just going to throw up a bunch of features and benefits at you and hope that you'll click the calendar link. Like here's my Calendly.

[00:18:14] Yeah. I mean, when I see the DMS that have, you know, two, three paragraphs, it's like, I don't even read it. It's just, I simply respond. No thanks. Because I know that that's the only way to stop the automation from continuing to send me messages, you know? Um, so I'm okay with automation to connect people and drive meaningful connect and be very mindful of like who you're targeting with that.

[00:18:36] Like, is it even the right person? Um, and you know, if you're actually gonna have a meaningful conversation with them, allow them to raise their hand and say that they're have interests before you just spam them with a link. Um, but don't use it to just set a sequence and send a bunch of features and benefits and spam them with your calendar link.

[00:18:53] Like that's not the way to do it. Sales hustlers. So if anybody in your organization or your leadership is telling you, that's the way to book meetings, they're lying to you and stop doing it right now. And guess what the side effects of that is when you send from, like, if, if you're a rep and you're sending a bunch of emails from your corporate domain and all that stuff, people can spam you there and like, say, Aw, screw cabinet.

[00:19:17] I'm not gonna buy it from him, but it's not as personal. Right. So you're burning your own personal image when you do this on LinkedIn. When you, when you try to sell that way, like I looked that person in the eyes only did. I'm like, ah, you, you know, it's not good. You don't want people associating you with that.

[00:19:33] Like, cool. But like, don't be mad at me, but if you do it wrong, you're not going to get the right sort of tension in it. And the thing is, is like people are going to judge books by their covers, right. And people, and your first impression matters. And if your first impression is you spamming the hell out of, on LinkedIn, trying to get them to book a meeting, then you've basically ruined your credibility specifically with that person that could have been we prospect for you.

[00:20:01] Yup, absolutely. Yeah. And by the way, if people do connect with you, a lot of people have their cell phone numbers. If you go look in their profile at. Information, you can find some, you know, low key, amazing cell phone number. I've seen some VPs that keep their cell phone numbers in there. I'm like, Oh, thanks.

[00:20:20] Right. Well, you got to use the number. You got to dial the digits digits, right? Yeah. He said, I want to talk about here. That's like a super takeaway is hand dialing socks. All right guys, like I'm not advocating that. I want every STR pick up their phone and going all day, or like even dialing on a, on a voice from whatever you want to call it.

[00:20:43] Like, I've heard, I've heard of reps actually using their cell phone to dial and I'm like, that cannot be efficient. Like you are. How many dials are you making a day? 10. Right. I mean, that's the reality for a lot of people, unfortunately, but, um, you know, when I saw the light and decided to go, so ho hardcore into like cold calling is the way everyone needs to be cold calling is when I figured out that there's technology for this right.

[00:21:12] Um, technology platforms like connect themselves, technology platforms like, or, um, like phone burner. Uh, monster connect. There's a bunch of these out there that are designed to use the phone phone numbers as a way to connect you live with people without you having to do any of the stupid dialing like dialing phone numbers is so 2005.

[00:21:32] In my opinion, like my reps make hundreds of calls a day. Don't dial one number, not one, it's two clicks and software is doing it for you. And it's connecting you live to people because at the end of the day, what are we trying to do? Why are we sending these emails? Why are we text people on LinkedIn? Why am I calling this number?

[00:21:49] Because I want to have a conversation. Sales is people talking to people, right? And it's people having opinionated conversations. That's the other thing that I think a lot of people could think about when they talk about the cold calling is. Have an opinion, right. And this is why I was born for this.

[00:22:08] Right. Like, uh what's uh, what's the, uh, lady Gaga, baby. I was born this way. I was born Nicole call. All right. Like, I love this because it's basically just calling, having an opinionated conversation about a topic I'm really good at having opinionated conversations. Right. Um, but having an opinion gets you to information that you need, even if you don't set a meeting.

[00:22:34] Yes. As grant Cardone is famously said, not interested is a level of interest. And I think that's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, but I sat back and thought about it for like 30 minutes. Um, I might, may or may not have been smoking pot at the time, but, uh, you know, not interested. Is a level of interest.

[00:22:52] Think about that. Not interested needs that they heard and saw you in some way, shape or form and responded. Yeah. Yeah. Now what do you do with not interested? I'm curious. What do you do with that? Interesting. And, uh, I know what I do with not interested, but I'm keen to hear what you would do with, if you're calling me and I say, Kevin, I'm not interested.

[00:23:14] You know, Colin, I speak with CEOs of companies just like yours. And they're generally interested in topics around podcasting and B2B sales. I'm curious. What makes you different? Not like that, right? Yeah. I could go with that. I could go with that. My minds. Mine's a little similar. So you told me you weren't interested in Kevin.

[00:23:38] I totally understand that. You're not interested. Do you mind sharing with me? Why? Yeah. Right. And it gets you the same result, right? Because a lot of times they think they're not interested or they're, they're, they're they're misinformed or they think they heard something or you just caught them at a bad time.

[00:23:53] And, you know, sometimes they don't even know why they're not interested in, you know, figuring out why they're not interested is going to help you get them interested. Hundred percent. Yeah. And you know, not interested being a level of interest means on the phone. There's a moment there. And the way I teach my reps.

[00:24:11] Is imagine you and your buddy are walking down the street and I say, Hey, Colin, we should go to the bar. And then you say, no, I'm not interested in going to the bar. And if we're friends and if it's a normal conversation, I go, all right, Kuwait. Right. I go to the bar, but in sales, it's my job to get you to the bar.

[00:24:32] Right? So if I, if I'm, if I'm having a sales conversation, we're walking down the street, you call and we should go to the bar. Not interesting. Go to the bar, Kevin, we have to literally step in front. I have to step in front of you. Whoa, Whoa, Colin. You don't want to go to the bar dude in the bar, there's cold beer football on TV and chicks.

[00:24:54] You're telling me you don't other words, look at every dude that looks like us is in the bar. You don't want to go to the bar. That's called having an opinion, right? Like having an opinion and understanding why you called that person in the first place. In that little bit of. Friction. Yeah, little bit of friction there.

[00:25:11] Every time that we get into a cold call and guess what? My, our statistics show at sales gig, 89% of our conversations start with not interested after the pitch, but we end up booking meetings on probably 14% of those. Non-interesting. First objection, right? Not interested is a level of interest. That means that they are saying something to you that you can, I don't even know if they're interested or not.

[00:25:40] It's just what they've said. It's just what they've said enough times to get enough people like you off the phone, because most people in sales are uncomfortable with that friction or are confident enough to have an opinion. Oh, yeah. To keep the conversation go. Oh yeah. That's that's the hard part. So the other, the other takeaway, um, if you're a rep doing calls, you should have two forms of not interested, not interested.

[00:26:12] No reason. Given is different than what I call not interested. Good. No, so good. No. Is this whole idea and this backs up to the global idea of account-based selling, which I think. We're all doing, account-based selling. If you're not doing account based selling, what are you doing? Like you just like randomly dialing random people, hoping that you randomly come across a great idea.

[00:26:33] No, like you're going after certain companies in certain verticals for certain reasons that might have certain business problems. Right. So that's, account-based, we're all doing it. Yeah. You can call it account based or not. But the idea of account-based is if I'm a territory rep, especially I've got my hundred and 40 accounts, 200 accounts, whatever it is that I need to go set meetings with.

[00:26:50] And I can only set me into these people because. Someone, two counties over one state over has the rest. Right. Good nose. Help us with this list, right. If I'm trying to sell the monster void and I call, and I don't talk to Colin, but I talked to Christopher and Christopher tells me some information, Hey, I'm calling to talk about CRMs.

[00:27:13] And my CRM is the tits and uncle blah. You should talk to me. And Christopher says, Yeah, dude. Um, I hear ya. We just signed a three-year deal with Salesforce like a month ago. Now any, any sales manager in the world doesn't want that meeting, like who wants a meeting with someone who just made a decision to buy a competitor?

[00:27:31] The odds of that turning into anything really fruitful very, very low. That's a nurture opportunity though, because now what do we know? We know they use Salesforce. We know they're in a three-year contract now in this account based model. If you're a sales salesperson or write that down in the

[00:27:48] So, so I, I train the reps that the nauseous, no reason given is the, the, the people that do exist that after the pitch, they say not interested by and they hang up before we go, Oh, those, those are the best customers. Those are the best customers. Once you get them interested. Right? Because then the next time your competition's knocking at the door, click not interested.

[00:28:10] The people that told me they weren't interested the first time I called her the best customers that are still with me today. That's right. That's right. They're the hardest ones. The ones that are interested right away. Those are the ones you gotta be careful. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, there's always the idea of like, if you get in there first, you can drive the thought process where if someone's already actively in any evaluation, you're playing catch up immediately.

[00:28:35] Right. They're already thinking about something else and you're trying to change their mind as opposed to someone who's a blank slate. Um, but the way I train my reps is the non-interested no reason given. Is anytime they slammed the phone. And I say, why didn't we get a meeting there? And it's like, they hung up, but the good, no, there is a written explanation for it.

[00:28:53] And we can take that back to our clients. We reply, we report all those to our clients. We give them the recordings and say, Hey, here's the 30 companies we talked to these executives. They said, they're not interested, but there's good reasons why. Right. Yeah. And so understand that, you know? Yeah. You know what they're using, why they're not interested in when the right time is to check back.

[00:29:10] Yep. So, and then th this is also something that a good note is a celebration for us. Like when I see good nose, I'm like, awesome. Those are really good training opportunities. Cause there's always something there I could have brought up or an angle here or there that could have maybe led to a meeting, but I like seeing good notes.

[00:29:28] Good notes means we're connecting with the right people and having opinionated conversations and the opinion didn't go our way. But then again, not every prospect is going to be a meeting. Right. And you're increasing the quality of your list. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Uh, sales reps, we live in a sea of rejection.

[00:29:45] You have to find positives in what you do day to day. Even if it's not, I closed a hundred K today. I set five meetings today. The, the practice of doing sales the right way will net positive outcomes that are not just. The binary. Did you get a meeting? Did you close the deal or not? Right. And I think that as a cultural movement in sales and digital sales in general will help lower turnover, make people happier, lower stress and drive more revenue because when someone doesn't get their shit kicked in, it doesn't feel like shit.

[00:30:19] They show up to work the next day, feeling better. And they're going to feel confident that they're doing the right things to get to the right place. Right. Because you can do everything right in sales and still lose. Happens all the time. Yeah. And the best people get more nos than yeses. That's right. And every to, none of you have to know that you're gonna embrace that.

[00:30:38] Like, like you just have to know when you sign, when you sign in and you click dial, you know that you're, there's a good chance. You're going to get an ass beat and you have to be okay with that and just enjoy it. Yep. Absolutely. Um, it's fun though. Like, I dunno, our reps actually enjoy it. Cause it's, it's fun that you get to talk to people it's tough when you don't get to talk to people, right.

[00:31:02] When right. If you're a sales rep that lives on email and you're like, well, maybe I'll just resend this group of 3000 people, another email chain and I'll get one or two responses. Like I did last part. We got in the laptop. You know, we are a people people, right? We should be personable. If you're in sales, you should be ready to have a cold conversation.

[00:31:24] Elevator pitches are easy, right? Like my reps train for one day on systems and processes. The second day on the job, they're making over a hundred dollars. Second day on the job. Right? When I was hired as an SDR at that startup, the raise all the venture money. I don't think I made a cold call for two months.

[00:31:43] Well, because you got to get that, you got to get that script. Perfect. And listen to all the recordings and mere people, pair parrot people and you know, all that good jazz, right. Course. Yeah. Well the script thing, you know, I talked for a long time about scripts, but scripts are the, my short thing about scripts to handrail, right?

[00:32:04] I think of a cold call as you're opening a door. When the person picks up there's one door that opens there's stairs, leading up to another door, the next door is the meeting. You can hold onto the hand rail. If you're not very good at running up steps, which is a lot of people. And I, I called the new newbie.

[00:32:22] Dialer's like infants, right? Infancy to hold on to something. When they're going upstairs, otherwise they're going to fall down. But when you got a guy like me or, or a senior person who's been doing this for years, I've made literally half a million calls in the last two, three years. Like I don't need a handrail.

[00:32:37] I know the topic of why I'm calling. I stick to the script in terms of flow. There's an entrance, uh, like this idea of like, like 10 45, uh, two, right? So the first 10 seconds earns you the next 45, which earns you the next two minutes. Hey, I'm Kevin with sales gig. Do you have. 35 seconds. I can tell you why I call today.

[00:32:58] Okay. I earned the first 10 to the 45, the 45 is the pitch and the hook at the end of that, I hope I get a dialogue where they say yes, no, maybe. And we talk about it, right. And there's Cheerios city there, but yeah, sales reps need to hold on to that. Handrail, use the script to get to the top of the thing, but when you're good enough, sometimes you only need to touch it once or twice, right?

[00:33:20] Yeah, we don't want to sound like robots. We can't sound like robots. And that's the difference between us and robocallers salespeople. All right, Kevin, tons of great nuggets in there. Thanks for coming on sales, hustlers. Uh, tons of value in here, uh, to up your game specifically around cold calling Kevin work in folks, connect with you.

[00:33:44] What do you got for them today? Yeah, I think the number one place is LinkedIn. Um, I'm big on there. You guys can see cold calling evangelists. Uh, no, I'm not an evangelical Christian, but Hey, uh, I am a cold calling member of the church of cold con. That's what, that's what I am, but connect with me on LinkedIn there.

[00:34:02] And then, uh, if you, if you're, if you're a firm needs to grow sales, check us out a fractional high-velocity outbound sales development. Awesome. Thanks again, Kevin. And if you're listening to the podcast, please subscribe, share with your friends and we're listening for your feedback. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of sales hustle.

[00:34:25] Are you a sales professional looking to take your sales career to the next level? If the answer is yes, then I want you to go over to sales, check us out. And if you feel that you are ready, set up a time to talk with me and my co-founder Chris, I'm your host, Colin Mitchell. And if you enjoyed this episode, feel free to leave us a review.

[00:34:48] And share the podcast with your friends.