In this episode of the Sales Hustle Podcast, Collin Mitchell welcomes Brian Goldsack as he shares how he was trained for sales, which later led him to build a high-quality network that delivers endless referrals. Let’s hear from Brian how having some emotional intelligence with the people you’re following up with can represent you well in the community.
Having to work in the professional services for several years now, Brian Goldsack believes that the most important thing is to understand what is important to his clients. Keeping his clients on track, he uses a systematic approach to help them based on their goals, risk tolerance, and time horizons. Brian firmly believes that strategies should be customized to achieve specific and measurable goals.
Brian is also the Owner of Novo Hill Real Estate, LLC which specializes in purchasing, repairing, and leasing properties within the greater Scranton area.
Check out Brian’s podcast, Success Fundamentals on the link below.
Podcast link: https://successfundamentals.com/
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Episode 117 - Brian Goldsack
Welcome to the sales hustle. The only no BS podcast, where we bring you the real raw uncut experiences from sales makers across various industries. The only place where you can get what you're looking for. Uh, your sales game today's episode is brought to you by sales cast sales cast helps sales professionals transform the relationship building process and win their dream clients.
[00:00:30] I'm your host, Colin. What is happening? Sales hustlers. Welcome to another episode. I'm super pumped to have Brian Goldsack on today. He's been in sales for 11 plus years and he knows a thing or two about building a high quality network that delivers endless referrals. So we're going to dig into that and see what that means.
[00:00:51] And also he's got a fantastic podcast that just came out success fundamentals. So I'm going to tell you a little bit more about that as well. Brian, welcome to sales hustle. I'm doing great. Happy to be here. How are you calling? Good. Good man. So I'm super curious. I think referrals is such an interesting topic because.
[00:01:12] For whatever reason, a lot of people in sales and you know, whether they are, whether they admit they're in sales or not, because you see all these people dressing up their titles with fancy things, or, you know, I mean, I got a sound, my kids on eating their vegetables and all kinds of things like that. So everybody's selling whether you want to admit it or not.
[00:01:30] Sorry. Um, referrals. Are essential and, you know, it's so much easier to go to a client that you did a great job for and ask for referrals. Yeah. I said referrals with an S I didn't say referral. Right. Then you go out there and find more business. And so I'm just curious, you know, tell us a little bit about, you know, how you built this high quality note.
[00:01:57] So winter. So it all started basically me going door to door. So when I built my book of business, the way I was trained was quite literally going in my community, that little pamphlets and business cards. Knocking on doors for ringing doorbells, hoping somebody would answer and then trying to Stripe up, strike up a conversation with the person behind the door and explain the services that we provide and hopefully get there.
[00:02:28] Their phone number, their name, maybe a little information about what they might need and knock on the next door and do that for a few years until you have a book of business. So that was the infancy of my career. And once things started to pick up and my books started to build, then it is a natural progression to, uh, work into having, uh, an intricate network of referrals.
[00:02:54] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so, uh, knocking on doors is brutal. Um, I mean, I've heard a lot of stories of people knocking on doors, selling Cutco knives. I've, I've, I've interviewed a lot of people that started doing that, but you learn so much from, I've never physically knocked on doors. I, I started my sales career in, uh, you know, boiler room sort of environment, making a lot of cold calls.
[00:03:22] Um, But similar, uh, you know, to knocking doors, like you, you learn a lot of things, right? You, you build a, you build a bit of a thick skin for the people that maybe slam the door in your face and say, no, go away, Matt. Interesting. Yeah, it's true. I actually, I remember when I was first going door to door. I was listening to a lot of different, you know, just sales podcasts, or like videos on YouTube.
[00:03:46] That was my big thing. And I remember one guy saying, going door to door, doing door to door sales for two years is equivalent to getting a bachelor's in communications simply. I'm like, whatever, it's probably not true, but I'll totally feel like I have a bachelor's in communications. And it's because like you said, you don't know who's behind that.
[00:04:08] Uh, so you have to kind of adapt each situation to, you know, whoever's behind that door and where they're at in that moment. And you become thick-skinned as you said, Yeah. What sort of body language are they putting off? What sort of tonality are they using? Do they seem like super busy? Did you just catch him in the middle of like their kids screaming and they're trying to make dinner and the dog just took a crap on the floor.
[00:04:35] Like all the above, all the above it's. Uh, but you're right. You get a thick skin about it. And, and the weird thing is. Did you actually start to get into it? Like after a while, it's almost like, like, I dunno if you've ever done any like running or any endurance sports. It's like always the first mile or two that's the hardest every single time.
[00:04:59] But then after a while, you're just kinda like in the groove and you just keep pedaling away, just keep peddling away. Yeah. I actually, when I'm, you know, Started cold calling and I still cold call today just because I'm weird. And I enjoy it. Um, I used to, I used to look forward to getting my first hangup of the day.
[00:05:18] It was like, yeah, I got that out of the way. I'm still, I'm still like, I don't like rejection. I know that people talk about this thick skin thing and they're like, yeah, after awhile, you know, you get used to rejection. Every time I got rejected, it's still hurt. It still hurts. But I guess the thick skin is.
[00:05:37] I don't know, just being, being used to the hurt. So you still feel the hurt, but you're like, oh, there's that hurt again rather than like, oh my God, this hurt, hurt so much. What is going on here? So the pain of rejection never really goes away. It's more of just like accepting the pain of rejection is what I would refer to as thick skin.
[00:05:59] Yeah. I mean, when you're in sales, like you're going to get way more nos than yeses. Like, even if you're at the, even if you're the best, you know, um, I like to think of like the baseball analogy, right? Like a great, a great baseball player hits, you know, a 300, which means, you know, most of the time they're not hitting.
[00:06:18] Right. Yeah. So, so, you know, you're going to get way more nos than yeses and, and, and yeah, it stings, but you don't let it, you know, you don't take it into your next call, your next. Knock on a door or let it stop you from moving forward. Right. And, and then you also, you know, um, I like to look at it's a lot of those nos as learning experiences, like, you know, you probably have some examples of like, when you, you know, went and knocked on a door and you may be set a particular thing or, you know, you could've done something different.
[00:06:55] Hmm, next time that happens. I'm going to do something different. So, you know, all of those nos are, are, are little learning lessons that are leaning up to getting less knows in the future. It's a great point. It's a great point. I completely agree. I remember. Um, I remember there were, first of all, when you knock on a lot of doors, thousands and thousands of doors, one thing I would say.
[00:07:20] It's it's considered like an antiquated technique, right by door to door sales. Right. And it's true. It is an antiquated technique, but it is so antiquated that at this point, it's almost like a novelty when it occurs. Right? If this was like 1936, there was probably like a door to door salesperson knocking on your door every 35 minutes or so, and close the curtains here they come.
[00:07:45] Oh God, the trombones or whatever they sold in 1936. And, uh, But, you know, it stopped, it stopped for a period of time. And now it's basically like people trying to sell you books or, uh, like cable subscriptions or whatever, or they're trying to sell you something. Is that a real thing? Like, is that legit?
[00:08:09] Like, do you have proof that you're really supposed to be selling that thing? Or it's like a religion you're like, wait, what is what what's what's happening? Right. So like it's, so people normally think that you're one of those things. Right. But what ends up happening is it's a very emotionally evocative experience because it is so anxiety producing for the person opening that door.
[00:08:32] Right. So it's very rememberable as a result. So although it is antiquated, it is, you know, later on that night, you know, they're saying around the dinner table, some weirdo just knocked on my door and was trying to convince me to use this service or buy this product. And it creates a buzz when you compare it to like internet marketing, where every day you're on Instagram scrolling and there's like 31 solicitations every minute.
[00:08:59] That can kind of just get mixed in with the sauce. Whereas door to door is like pop it's, like really in your face. It demands a response from you. Yeah. Yeah. And then you can follow that up with a calling. You're like, Hey, I'm that weirdo that knocked on your door? Like, they're not going to forget you.
[00:09:17] That's true. That's true. And other is, I would consider it door to door. Marketing is probably easier than door to door sales. Okay. And the, and the distinction would be, it's kind of like, um, imagine if somebody came to your door, And I don't know, pick any product. Let's say you're opening up a restaurant and you knock on the door and you say, Hey, real quick, I want to let you know, I'm opening a restaurant.
[00:09:49] Here's our menu. I'd love to see at some point, having a nice day, you're not necessarily selling, you're more marketing. And in some circumstances that might lead to a deeper conversation that might eventually lead to you getting a new client or customer. So. I would describe myself as more of like a door to door marketer, not necessarily a door to door salesman, at least in the infancy of my career.
[00:10:15] Um, yeah, I've actually seen some door to door sales done. Well, you know, where they're like, and they typically, it typically goes like this or the typically like, um, you know, Hey, we were in the neighborhood, you know, Your neighbor so-and-so which typically, I don't know who it is, but he's my neighbor, supposedly, you know, they did some work for him or her, you know?
[00:10:38] Um, but you know, they, they, they, they create that like familiarity, you know, he was having this problem and we helped him with this and we thought maybe, you know, you might be interested in learning more. Hmm. Sure. Well, like what, you know, tell me more about that. You know, so piquing some interest and, and, and, and shutter kind of, you know, today in, in the digital world, we call it social proof.
[00:11:00] Right. You have social proof, but it's like, Hey, there's like proof in your face. Like, we, we work with your neighbor, he trusted us, like you should too. Right. Um, and so, all right, so I want to kind of, you know, Move forward a little bit here. Right? So the beginning, you know, of your escrow, like you just, you did something crazy that people are doing.
[00:11:19] You literally knocked on thousands of doors and did some, you know, door, market, and door knocking sales slash marketing, um, you know, helped you, you know, start to build a book of business. Um, and now, you know, years later, You don't have to do any more door knocking. And, and so I'm curious to dig into like, you know, how you've been able to build this network that just, you know, sends you endless referrals because it's something where a lot of salespeople struggle.
[00:11:50] Yeah. It's, uh, it's a, it's, uh, not an easy transition to pinpoint like exactly when it happened. Um, but what I would say is I did a lot of reading and I read this one book, which I cannot remember for the life. May I have it somewhere, but anyway, the premise of the book was. Basically almost every beginning of a career, especially in sales or even just, if you're an entrepreneur of any sort, the beginning of it is just survival mode.
[00:12:18] Right. So you're just getting out there, like, pretend you just landed on a, on a tropical island somewhere and you're all by yourself. You just trying to find some coconuts and some fresh water. You're not trying to build an irrigation system yet. You're not trying to build your nice tree house or anything.
[00:12:35] You're just trying to live. Right. So in the beginning of my career, I met a lot of people and some of them later were not necessarily yeah. Ideal clients. Okay. Yeah. So, so I ended up learning that what you want to do is you want to basically service the hell out of. Your ideal clients, whatever industry you're in and you want to make, you want to make at least one contact with them.
[00:13:06] Is there a months or every other month? And just say, Hey, look, you know, there was an interesting piece of information I thought you might find useful. I was looking at your accounts. Here's a quick suggestion. I would make, I know everybody's afraid of this right now. Here's my opinion on it. How's everything with you, anything going on in your life?
[00:13:23] I should be aware of. And at the end of the call, Hey look, have you happened to run into anybody that you think might utilize or might find our services useful? And inevitably you usually will get maybe at least one, one referral from just going through those calls every month, every other month. So I had a period of time.
[00:13:48] I was calling my top, my top clients the same day of the week, every week for one to two years touching base. Next thing I knew, Hey, you have to talk to my sister. She needs help with X, Y, Z. Hey, my neighbor just sold this house. You got to talk to them about X, Y, Z. And I found that my network started to build from.
[00:14:09] Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. They're probably like, man, we got to give this guy a referral or he is not going to stop calling us.
[00:14:18] It's you know, anybody, anybody with a pulse, please introduce him. Just like, please stop calling me. It's too much already. Yeah. I mean, I think it makes a, I think it makes a lot of sellers uncomfortable asking for referrals, but if you make it a consistent habit, like you mentioned, Brian, it becomes easier and it just becomes, it just becomes part of what you, what you do, what you say, you know, you, you probably have some pretty consistent talk tracks of things that you're saying, things that you're teaching people ways that you're adding value to people in your network.
[00:14:57] Add that in of asking for those referrals and the great thing that I love that you brought up is it doesn't even have to be people that are actually working with you today. If you're, if they're in your network and you're having conversations and maybe they're not, it's not quite the right time for them.
[00:15:17] To work with you, um, and whatever you do, maybe it's a really long sales cycle where it really takes a while to massage and nurture those relationships till it's finally time to do business together. Um, if you're still delivering a great experience and adding value, like you said, is totally appropriate to still ask for a referral just because they can't do business with you or the time's not right.
[00:15:40] It doesn't mean that they don't know somebody that, okay. That's a great point. Another thing that I was thinking of when you were talking was. Teaching centers yeah. Of influence influences what we call them. So people that are in similar industries to you, let's say compliment your industry, let's say you own, I know an auto body shop.
[00:16:00] And you would find that you often have to connect people to a mechanic shop or whatever, right? Yeah. Teaching the people in your network of professionals, how to give you referrals and who your ideal client is. And also asking them who is your ideal client? So I can better send, I can send better referrals your way as well.
[00:16:25] And one of the biggest pieces of advice I got was actually from a buddy of mine, who's a business owner and he goes, When you're, when you're trying to connect me to somebody, here's what you say. He goes, you don't say, Hey, look, I know this guy that owns an auto body shop. Um, do you want me to have him call you to talk about the dents in the side of your car?
[00:16:48] Because people will say, or why don't you give him a call and he'll take care of the dance. Nine times out of 10. They're not going to call that guy. Let's say, yeah, give me his card. I'll I'll call him when I have some time. It's better to say, I'm going to have him call you to talk about getting those dents out of your car, because now they're expecting a call.
[00:17:10] So it's almost like you're amping up the service. Cause it's like, look full service, baby. I'm having my guy call you to take care of those dents. And number two, the precedent is not for them to make the call. It's the expectation that a call is. They could still reject that person, but at least the call has been made.
[00:17:29] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a big fan of, uh, I'm a big fan of making, making intros, you know, via LinkedIn DM. You know, because boom, it's in your face. You know, the conversation has already started, right? Like, Hey, the thread is there is happening. Whether you want to hit or not. That's cool. I've never actually thought of that.
[00:17:52] So LinkedIn DMS. It's a gray, it's a group DM. It's a group DM. Yeah. So you, I don't know if you've ever tried it, but like, you know, you and I have had some one-on-one, you know, uh, exchanges on LinkedIn, you know? Uh, but you can add people to the conversation or you can send a group message on LinkedIn. Uh, so now there's like peer pressure a little bit you're giving a little bit and then they, yeah.
[00:18:17] Then they see your profile. They see you. They have, you know, familiar face. Um, they can see what you're all about. They can see what type of content you're putting out there. By the time you actually schedule a call, like if you're doing LinkedIn, right. They already know you and what you're all about and the type of content you're putting out there, the type of value you're offering, you know, um, it's a great way for intros.
[00:18:42] You know, people, a lot of times people are comfortable doing an email intro and I found that sometimes people are not that responsive. On email, like, you know, I get referrals like crazy as well, like yourself. Um, and I found that, you know, the peop the referrals that I get sent via email is a lot harder to get a conversation started sometimes where with LinkedIn group DMS, which is my preference.
[00:19:07] And I try to tell people, Hey, just do that. It's the best way. Um, you know, the conversation has already started, you know, attribute that to. That's that makes so much sense. Like if I was like, just, it came to chain, email. I would feel less inclined to respond to it. Is it just that email is uglier than LinkedIn?
[00:19:25] Like what is, what do you think it is? I think that, um, with LinkedIn, you know, within a matter of a couple of minutes, they can get a good sense of who you are and what you're about, you know, in, in, in they can feel like, oh, wow, you know, this, this is a good referral for me. You know, now. On the flip side, if your LinkedIn profile is crap and you don't have a great picture, you're not putting out content or you don't have a picture at all, then I highly do not recommend it.
[00:19:54] And just that like dark that darkness, the absence of a human being, but like a silhouette. There's something theory about that. Yeah. It blows my mind when I see people on LinkedIn that still don't even have a profile picture. Yeah. They're like, why is nobody responding to me? My picture just looks like an ominous ghost.
[00:20:12] Why am I not getting any responses? Yes. Yeah. That damn. I said, wow. I liked it. Yeah. Yeah. So, so something you mentioned right, is, is it's just make it a habit of asking for referrals. Number one, and, uh, sales hustlers, keep in mind, you know, I keep saying referrals with an S not referral. Hey, can I get a referral?
[00:20:36] Hey, is there anybody, you know, that, you know, is there, you know, what people do, you know. You know, plural, you like ask them for a couple of referrals. It's just as hard to ask for three, as it is to ask for one, you know, or even be more specific, is there three to five people that you, you know, you know, that I, that I could help out, you know?
[00:20:57] Uh, and, and so the clients that you serve, though, like you gotta, you gotta really serve them at a high, high level for them to be open to giving you a referral. Right. So, I mean, you talked about your early on clients, like checking in with them probably way more than they wanted you to, right? Yeah. We actually, we, we develop stats on, on that.
[00:21:21] Like, because we, we send out these questionnaires and we get anonymous answers from my clients. They're like, how about, like, how often are you getting contacted? Is it like too much? Is it just right? Is it not enough? And it's always just, right. So I'm like, all right, once a month, like three minute call, touch base, see how they're doing appropriate.
[00:21:42] At least that's what I was doing maybe once every two months, but you got to know the client too. That's another client. And like, some of your clients are like very what's the word? Like, uh, talkative. They, they want to see how you're doing and they want to tell you what's going on. Uh, and then there's some that like, you know, they're nice people, but maybe they don't want to chit chat that much.
[00:22:00] Maybe call them every other month. And then you just have some clients that like, Hey, they use your service wants. They never want to talk to you again. They're good. Or they bought your product once don't bug me anymore. So I have some emotional intelligence with who those people are and that you're following up with, because those are also the people that are likely to give you a referral, because if they love it, And they want to talk to you once a month and touch base and have a little chit chat with you.
[00:22:25] I mean, hello. Those are the people that are going to represent you well in the community. Yeah. Yeah. My survey would look like this. Hey, you know, I'm calling you in that just right amount. But if you don't give me a referral, it's going to become that too much amount. So me too, what do you got for me? I'm going to call you a couple of times a day, just right, right before you go to sleep.
[00:22:48] Yeah, no, I mean, yeah, you gotta make sure you're not over a Colleen too, because if you piss them off and you're like, man, this jerk is always calling me. Good chance. You're not getting any referrals from them. Yeah, or it's a good, great way to weed out the clients that don't like you it's another, uh, yeah.
[00:23:08] Um, awesome man. Tell people a little bit about, uh, the podcast. You know, what you guys are talking about, why you and Chris started it and where they can find it. Yes. Um, good friend of mine and colleague Chris Sykes started our own podcast on success fundamentals. It can be found at success, fundamentals.com, calling you a big help with that.
[00:23:33] And Chris Arthur, we appreciate you guys. Um, so basically the premise of this show is, uh, we were sitting down Chris and I, and we're like, you know, what is it that successful people know. That we don't know. What are these wildly successful people thinking about every day? What are they doing every day?
[00:23:53] Are there any similarities just between these people? Is there any wisdom that we can glean from these people? So we were like, Hey, let's make a podcast where all we do is just interview successful people, regardless of the industries that they're in, that made it to the top, pick their brain on their mantras and philosophies and dues on bark ethic.
[00:24:13] And see if we can get something, some wisdom out of them. So we're really excited. We've had some great answer views and it's, we're really enjoying the experience. So please tune in. We'd love to have you listen. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you so much, Ryan, for coming on today. Really appreciate it. Um, I think this goes down as the first episode that we really went deep on door knocking, so it works and, uh, you know, you're, you're proof that it works and I think, you know, Sales hustlers.
[00:24:44] If you're listening, like, you know, get out there and start, you know, ask them for some referrals because it makes a big difference. And, you know, once you're done doing that, go ahead and check out success fundamentals. We will drop the link there in the show notes. So you can subscribe on whatever podcast platform you enjoy.
[00:25:01] And you're listening to this on today. And as always, if you enjoyed today's episode, please, please, please share the show with your friends. Write a short review and as always. For your feedback as well. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of sales hustle. Are you a sales professional looking to take your sales career to the next level?
[00:25:20] If the answer is yes, then I want you to go over to sales cast.com, check us out. And if you feel that you are ready, set up a time to talk with me and my co-founder Chris, I'm your host, Colin Mitchell. And if you enjoyed this episode, feel free to leave us a review. And share the podcast with your friends.