Sales Hustle is now Sales Transformation
June 15, 2022

#330 S2 Episode 199 - PAIN, NOT PERSONA: Finding Customer With Problems You Solve with Jordan Crawford

We’ve talked about the Ideal Customer Profile just recently here in Sales Transformation. This time, Collin Mitchell brings in Jordan Crawford, co-founder of Blueprint, to talk about a whole new level of searching your ICP, where you focus on finding the customers with the problems that your company solves. Jordan presents his ideas and experiments to show us that strategies can be built and solutions can be offered by finding customers by pain, not persona.

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HIGHLIGHTS

Jordan's sales story
Finding customers who have the problems you solve
Personalizing based on pain not persona
Finding pains by data
The power of experiments

QUOTES

Jordan: “People think it's about the person. And that's the thing that's not really scalable.”

Jordan: “Usually is Just about understanding that targeting and describing the work that you did back to them. And it doesn't have to be a one-by-one exercise.

Jordan: “I only focus on companies. So companies are a much easier ocean to boil than people because people's data changes very, very frequently.

Jordan: “ Understand these things, right company, right place, the right title, you know, right channel, then it's gonna, you're just going to have a much better time because you're focused on the things that are based on actual customer problems and their context.”

Connect with Jordan on LinkedIn and learn more about what he’s been working on!

Links to check out:
Blueprint Website: https://www.blueprintgtm.com/
Clay Website: https://www.clay.com/salestransformation

Connect With Collin on LinkedIn and find out what’s new in Sales Transformation and other things he’s up to!

Want to Start, Grow or Monetize Your Podcast? Book a Free Strategy Call HERE!


We’ve talked about the Ideal Customer Profile just recently here in Sales Transformation. This time, Collin Mitchell brings in Jordan Crawford, co-founder of Blueprint, to talk about a whole new level of searching your ICP, where you focus on finding the customers with the problems that your company solves. Jordan presents his ideas and experiments to show us that strategies can be built and solutions can be offered by finding customers by pain, not persona.

Join Our Free Podcast Community HERE!

Want to solve a leaky sales funnel? Get Signup for your Free RevenueGrid trial HERE! 

Want Your Reps Hitting Quota in 2022? Get Your Wingman Free Trial HERE!

HIGHLIGHTS

  • Jordan's sales story
  • Finding customers who have the problems you solve
  • Personalizing based on pain not persona
  • Finding pains by data
  • The power of experiments

QUOTES

Jordan: “People think it's about the person. And that's the thing that's not really scalable.”

Jordan: “Usually is Just about understanding that targeting and describing the work that you did back to them. And it doesn't have to be a one-by-one exercise.

Jordan: “I only focus on companies. So companies are a much easier ocean to boil than people because people's data changes very, very frequently.

Jordan: “ Understand these things, right company, right place, the right title, you know, right channel, then it's gonna, you're just going to have a much better time because you're focused on the things that are based on actual customer problems and their context.”

Connect with Jordan on LinkedIn and learn more about what he’s been working on!

Links to check out:

Connect With Collin on LinkedIn and find out what’s new in Sales Transformation and other things he’s up to!

Want to Start, Grow or Monetize Your Podcast? Book a Free Strategy Call HERE!

Looking to start your own Podcats? Book a FREE strategy call. 🚀

Transcript

[00:00:00] In the world of sales, you either sink or swim or breakthrough to the next level. My name's Colin Mitchell. And this is sales transformation, a new kind of sales show designed to bring you through the epic life-changing moments of elite sellers. So you can experience your own sales transformation.

[00:00:29] Hey, before we start today's episode, I wanted to bring you in on the best kept secret in B2B sales. If you're serious about social selling and your only strategy is cold. The through LinkedIn you're missing the mark big time. Learn how I fully manage revenue generating podcasts can change your life and your pipeline@saleschasm.com.

[00:00:55] All right. Welcome to another episode of sales transformation. I've got a fantastic guest for you today. I've got Jordan Crawford on. He helped grow zinc.com from zero to 100 million in GMV and built growth systems for companies like main street, uh, ironclad. And vouch now he helps companies build automated ABM workflows to target prospects by pain, not persona, which is obviously why I knew that I needed to have him on the show.

[00:01:26] Jordan, how are you? I have to do it just grade today. I didn't bring my cookie today, though. I know that you wanted me to, because last time I had it was, it was, it was bad. Oh man. I mean, you are forever going to be the chocolate chip cookie guy. Um, I don't think there's really anybody who can steal that title from you.

[00:01:46] Um, the first time I met Jordan, he was describing how he ate a chocolate chip cookie that totally destroyed his hands. So now pretty much every time we talk. Did you have a cookie today? Cookie guy that's right. Ever forever. So I told him because I'm sure we'll have him back at some point. The next time he's got to bring a chocolate chip cookie.

[00:02:08] Sure. I will do one for every listener. Right. That's a lot cookies. We want to thank our listeners. Um, we just passed a million downloads, which were super. Just congrats, honestly, mind blowing, um, that there's been that many people that have listened to the show, but without the listeners, like, you know, we probably quit, quit doing this a long time ago, so we owe it all to you.

[00:02:35] Um, Jordan, Give us your sales story. And then let's get into some really interesting topics here that you've planned out. You've got some great examples that you're going to give because we like to get tactical here so that people can take things away and put them into action. So it gives your sales story.

[00:02:53] Um, what was not, you know, in between the lines, what was not in your bio? What do we need to know? Yeah. Uh, well, thanks so much for having me. I'm so grateful to be here. My sales story, boy, uh, I have been in growth since 2016 and tried a lot of crazy different things. Um, uh, from, you know, working at sort of some, a Bitcoin company.

[00:03:14] Uh, I, uh, as you mentioned, zinc.com, I helped build main streets, outbound engine. They closed a million dollars in three months of the system going live and a lot of trial and error and outbound is a really, really challenging channel. And most of my time has been spent thinking about outbound email as a channel, and it gets only harder and harder and harder because it's free to access, which means there's just a lot of noise.

[00:03:38] So. Almost all of the types of problems I think about are how do we scale great outbound without leading to this world of, Hey Jordan, you like chocolate chip cookies. I heard you like chocolate chip cookies on a podcast. Do you want my B2B SAS tool? And it's like, you know, those things are unrelated. Like w w like that, that doesn't count and you can't scale it.

[00:04:00] So, um, or he can't scale it well, and it's not about problem. So that's kind of my whole mantra. There is. How do you find people that have the problem that you solve? Yeah, that's the million dollar question. That's right. Um, so, so yeah, I mean, outbound is getting harder, right? And I mean, frankly, I think a lot of executives or decision makers or buyers, whatever you want to call them.

[00:04:28] Frankly, just ignore a lot of stuff because they just kind of assume it's going to be crap. Um, you know, you hear people talking about digital pollution, right. And, you know, spamming your Tam and whatever you want to call it. Right. We've heard all the things, but like you're saying, there is still a way to do it.

[00:04:46] Right. Personalization just to check the box of like personalization doesn't work and isn't scalable. Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly right. And, uh, to pull up that thread about personalization, people think it's about the person and that's the thing that's not really scalable. And so we've seen all these tools with like, AI, right?

[00:05:07] Like, oh, how do you find out that Jordan's on a podcast? So extract some content from that podcast and say it to Jordan. So he'll pay attention. Yeah. But that doesn't help. Like why me? Uh, and so sellers really need to be able to figure out, like they need to reduce the size of the ocean, right? Like, which are the companies that are going to be good fits for you.

[00:05:27] Um, what are the channels that your customers are? Maybe they're not in cold email, like don't try to cold email engineers. Like, it just is not a good idea. There that's a hard group to, to reach on email. Like, are you sure you're targeting the right title, go read some job descriptions of those titles to know for sure that they solve the problem that you solve.

[00:05:43] Um, Right approach. Right. So you might want to think about sequencing things so that, um, ideally they'll be exposed to in other channels. Um, and then getting that message, right. Usually is just about understanding that targeting and describing the work that you did back to them. And it doesn't have to be a one by one exercise.

[00:06:03] Um, but you do need to think about how can I take what I'm doing and turn it into a system. And that is by taking. Complex problem of an email and breaking it down into how do I remove my context from this? So I can teach someone to do one step of this process. Um, all right. So, and I think that's also a big misconception is like, people are like, you know, Good personalization takes too long.

[00:06:29] So we're just going to play the numbers game. Right. Um, and so you're saying, no, you can personalize based on pain, uh, rather than just, you know, job title or Hey, you know, some sort of trigger, you change the job. So you're likely to buy now or all of these things that, and I think part of it is like, These things do sort of work a little bit.

[00:06:53] Right. Which makes people continue doing them obviously, but you're saying there is a better way. Um, and it is scalable and it doesn't have to be one-to-one. Right. So I'm curious when you, before we kind of get into more tactical of, of what that way is, like, when did you come to this realization or like, when did you start to like really focus on like, how do we find people that have the pain that we solve and how do we reach them and how do we see.

[00:07:19] Well, I should say, it's not like I'm the first person who ever thought this idea. Um, uh, I watched a talk by the, uh, the guy that ran growth at segment and drift and gorgeous. Uh and he talked a lot about building some of these automated systems. Uh, that look for, like, you know, he built a system that looked for bad, uh, customer support reviews, uh, about shipping times, for example, for gorgeous.

[00:07:44] And then there are customer support software and then ping the seller. It's like, wow. It seems like people are really upset that you didn't get back to them, a shipping information. Did you know that your current tool can't automate that? But my tool does, right. So that's like, oh, you have a pain. You just saw this bad review and maybe you've had two or three or four of them.

[00:08:02] And you're like, yeah. Wow. 14, they got to pull that tracking information and that's a pain in the ass. So I think that, that, that type of thinking sort of, uh, is what inspired me to start started figuring out what are other ways that, uh, that we can do this both programmatically and with people. And so, um, just but thinking about it in terms of what does this look like if you're doing it, um, at scale and where do you start.

[00:08:29] To begin to do it at scale. Yeah. So tell me about how, you know, you could do it with people, like, give me an example. Yeah. So let's talk about this from, cause I, uh, only focused on companies, so the companies are a much easier ocean to boil than people because people, data. Very very frequently. And so identifying Jordan, uh, and what exact moment Jordan is that is much harder to do than identifying what Jordan's company is doing.

[00:08:59] And what's Jordan's role in that company. And so let's talk about like two examples of, uh, what this might look like, kind of with a scale approach first, and then, um, thinking about how can you take an approach that seems not scalable and scale. So I have a huge database of job descriptions. So we have cold.

[00:09:19] We're basically scanning companies every day, looking for their posted jobs and figuring out how often they're, um, they're opening jobs. They're closing jobs are shaving the job description. And there's a lot of really interesting metadata that you can mine at scale inside those job descriptions. So let me give you two examples within this sort of bucket.

[00:09:39] The first example is I did some work for, um, uh, some prelim work for dover.com, their recruiting tech agency. Right? Well, what are the types of people that need a recruiting tech agency? Well, if you have open positions, that's interesting. But now think about how long have those positions been open. Now think about how many of those positions are open for how long.

[00:10:00] So we did some math and, uh, we were able to calculate across my entire data set. There was one company that has lost a hundred years of productivity in the last 90 days, or last 300 days because of the total sum of open positions that they have. Um, uh, and the length of, of all of those open positions.

[00:10:20] Right? So it's like you have lost one. Like old humans worth of productivity. Uh, like w w w what are you going to do about that? Right. And so that's like one example within sort of the, the jobs tremor, the other piece here, and stop me if I'm going on for too long. But the other piece is. Let's say that your like gong, uh, everyone knows gong, probably this audience, right?

[00:10:44] So who are the best people for gong? Well, these are folks that have very complex sales teams that, uh, that need to where there's a lot riding on the line, right. You're selling to fortune 100 fortune 500 companies. You have a lot of people touching. Cycle. So how could we determine that? Well, you could look for things like fortune 100 fortune 500 in the, in the job descriptions, you can look at, uh, enterprise, right where it's like mid-market enterprise.

[00:11:11] So they're selling to more serious buyers. You can look for CXOs, right? We sell to CXOs. So again, more serious buyers. You can look if they have multiple languages or they're in multiple different geographies, APAC, AMEA, like Spanish, French. Right. So you're starting to see the case build for gong because wow.

[00:11:29] You've got. Sales reps that you're hiring, selling to serious buyers in a bunch of different locations that, uh, that probably, that don't have access to any of these tools. Right. You can scan for the tools because they mentioned them, no sort of sales, intelligence tools, and maybe they mentioned training to, wow, how are you going to do all that?

[00:11:46] Like, it seems like if one person comes in and says something really goofy to your, uh, you know, to, to a prospect that that can screw up a deal, that's going to take nine months. Um, and you can tell that programmatically and job descriptions by, I mean, we basically will download all of the job descriptions in one file.

[00:12:01] So you can see how frequently any given keyword appears and then group them into these pain based buckets. So not only do you know who to target, but what to say to them, Yeah. Okay. So, so, so give me an example, right? So you, you, you, you gave us a great example of, okay. How do we find companies based on.

[00:12:24] You know, we have a good sense that they have a pain that we know that we can solve with our software. So then how do you take that pain that you think, right, because you're still kind of guessing a little bit, but you're close and turn it into good outreach. That's gonna stand out and not be like every other piece of, you know, cold email that, you know, executives are getting on a regular basis.

[00:12:48] Yeah. So, um, what this looks, uh, is that the. Buckets of keywords can turn into sentences. And sometimes what you can do is one of the ways that we can query our data is to look at these keywords and then say, but not these keywords. So you can kind of find out, say, Hey, um, Hey Jordan, I saw that you're expanding your sales team.

[00:13:09] And that specifically you have reps in EMEA. APAC, uh, and that they are asked to sell to fortune 100 companies, uh, and that you're selling the C-suite. It seems like there's a lot on the line for you. And I was pretty surprised when in those job descriptions, which are pretty intricate, that you don't talk at all about any software that can record monitor or train the 52 reps that you have.

[00:13:33] How are you thinking about improving their quality over. Yeah. That's what that message looks like. And it's all about them, right? It's not about me. There's no, I was joking with somebody who was like, I would love to get on a call. Well, of course you would love to get on a call. You're a fucking salesperson.

[00:13:49] And so, but no, that's not, that's not my problem. Right? Like you need to be talking about the prospect's problem and, and that's, that's what this kind of looks. That's like one. This looks like it's scale. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of people that think like, oh, I'd love to get on a call or, Hey, I'd love to learn more about this.

[00:14:06] And it's like, you got to give your prospect a good reason to want to get on a call. Cause they're busy and they're getting outreach from. I don't know, who knows how many people on a regular basis phone, LinkedIn email, multiple channels is coming at them from all directions. Why the heck should they give you their time?

[00:14:24] Like, please at least give them a good reason. And the easiest way you can do that is like, you know, something they don't know, or you can teach them something that they haven't thought about. Or you can maybe challenge their thinking a little bit. Like they need to feel like what is Jordan. That I don't know.

[00:14:41] And that's like the only motivation that's going to get me on a call with Jordan. Well, even better. What does Jordan know about my business that I don't know? Right. And that's the kind of bar here, uh, that, uh, that will really drive replies. So, and, and you hit the nail, you hit the nail on the head here.

[00:14:57] Um, so let's talk about another example that seems unscalable and how you might think about scaling it. So I'll kind of read you off this. Copy. This got a 30% positive reply rate. Um, Uh, looking through company's LinkedIn presence. I noticed that some of your recent ads aren't getting the right kind of engagement specifically.

[00:15:14] I saw commenter name with CommInsure title in comments or country engage, and they didn't seem to be a good lead for you. And based on some analysis from similar web, it looks like you're spending at least amount on display ads. This is why I'm reaching out. If you could be a hundred percent certain that only companies like reference case study would see your ads, would you be.

[00:15:32] To experimenting I'm CEO, I'm Keith CEO primer CPMs price per thousand are down 20%. So it's good time to experiment. In short, if you spend $2,500 today, you'll get $7,500 worth of exposure. There's like right during when the pandemic hit, um, when rippling is primary, they went from a 2% to a 5% demo rate by targeting ads only to specific leads.

[00:15:51] If you could know your ads would only target companies like reference customer, would that be interesting? Yeah. Um, so all about them. And so this seems like, oh my gosh, how much time do you spend on that, Jordan? Well, um, if you notice some of the personalization, uh, it's all scalable. So, you know, uh, basically when we scored the Tam here, we looked at like only B2B domains with high traffic from similar web, like with a lot of traffic coming from paid ads.

[00:16:16] So similar web will tell you that who are currently running ads, right? You can have an outsourcer look inside of, uh, LinkedIn ads to, to know that. Um, and have a healthy demand gen team. So now you've like drastically reduced the amount of domains that you go after. Now you can out, you can basically turn this into factory thinking where you as a sales rep, don't need to do this.

[00:16:37] You can hire outsource, do this. So having outsource or find their ads link. Click on anyone who commented to get their name, do they have, are they X title? Right? Like an X title is a title similar to the titles that are on there on the prospect's case study page. Do they live in Y country if not grab that country?

[00:16:55] And you can just insert that into a spreadsheet and you can have someone in the opposite time zone to you go to bed, they can enrich those leads. And so that's something that seems like, wow, so much work put in one email, but you thought about it as a process that you can outsource. And all you're doing is thinking like.

[00:17:11] Marketers think of CAC cost of customer acquisition. So if you can spend a hundred dollars, like a hundred dollars, a hundred dollars per domain, like that seems like so much, but once your commission check, if that domain gets in, if you got a 30%, replier, what's that worth to you spend it on your own pocket.

[00:17:26] Um, but you need to think in this sort of factory model of how can you remove your context? Um, and it still be about the prospect's pain. Yeah. Wow. I can tell you get fired up about this stuff and there's a way to do it, right. There's a way to do it. Right. But you, but it's so hard as a rep because it's like, they're put on a treadmill.

[00:17:47] They're asked to produce results. Now it doesn't matter what happened next. Like, it doesn't matter what happened the month before. It's like, what have you done for me lately? So the incentive model, doesn't set them up for this. So if you can remove yourself from that constant company pressure for two or three weeks, plan out how you're going to do.

[00:18:04] And then run a cadence of experiments. Like just write down some of your best ideas and who cares, how long they take you remove time from the equation. Right. If you could send the very best message to someone you had unlimited time, what would you say to them about their problem? Yeah. Yeah. And I love how.

[00:18:23] You gave an example of how you could actually scale this, because I think that's the biggest lamest excuse of why most people don't approach things this way. Um, but you also, you know, are. You know, taking things that, you know, here's, here's the one thing I'll say is, you know, I'm a big believer of, of being, you know, personalized and also being relevant.

[00:18:49] And, and I see a lot of times reps get in this, like where they spend way too much time. Right? Like they think like they've got to spend. Sir. Like I'm not even joking, like 30 minutes to like come up with a good email. Right. Which then, then gosh, how long does it take to then write the email? And then God forbid, if you're using video, how many takes to get the perfect video.

[00:19:12] Right. And then like now you've spent like almost an hour, uh, maybe, maybe I'm over exaggerating a little bit, but I don't know. Is that an over-exaggeration? No, I mean, and I think that this is the problem, right? When you finish that, you start over from the beginning again, which is insane to me. Like you don't you just like, oh, there's another prospect.

[00:19:33] I'm going to try something brand new. And so I think that the two things that, that your listeners might want to know. Here is that first you need to find a domain focus because you could spend all that time and it's like, oh, sorry, we don't have a demand gen team. Well, fuck. Like I spent all this time, like selling this demand gen product to a company there's either know demand gen team.

[00:19:53] And I like, I personalize the video and I, you know, I took, I took a selfie of me with my fridge and I did, you know, it's like all the creative I'm like, yeah, like. I found their address. I went down to Google street view. I took, I was like, oh, I've seen your home before. You know, it's like, why? Like, and it's like, they're not even a good fit.

[00:20:15] So first you need to figure out what is the, what is the ocean that you should, what is the lake that you should plan, right. And that once you have, and you need them, you need to explain into the experiment a little bit. I mean, hopefully your company knows this, but you know, um, maybe not. I mean, you know, you've got.

[00:20:32] Yeah, the app absolutely call it like, and one of the things that when you talk about experimentation, the thing that comes to my mind is that create hypotheses ahead of time. All right. What are the five tests? The 10 tests that you're going to do, write them down and it's okay if they take a lot of time, but then if it works, then you have to break it down.

[00:20:50] How can I remove my context to automate this play with outsourcers, with technology, uh, with engineers. Um, and if it does work. Just repeat the same thing for the next lead. No. Think about how do I put this thing on rails, automate it, and if I have to use outsourcers great. And then try the next campaign.

[00:21:08] And you're always just working on the system. Um, you work in the system and then you work on the system and those are two different things. Yeah. And I mean, I think that one thing that I want to touch on, cause I think is really important that you mentioned, right. Is, um, you know, you try these experiments.

[00:21:27] Well, I think people need to understand like trying it once that's not an experiment, you know, like so many times one person or, you know, you people send 30 personalized. Well, you sent them to the wrong people. Like, no, it's not the video doesn't work. Like your messaging sucked or your targeting sucked, you know?

[00:21:49] That's exactly right. Yeah. And so, um, so I'm gonna give you some more practical tips about how you might do this. One of the things that we're building right now is that people think they know their titles like, oh, I'm talking to the VP of customer support. Uh, no, like the world is way more complicated than that.

[00:22:05] Um, then that thought process you have in your head. So we're going to expose some of our data so you can search by problems. So if you, uh, if you're a. Company reduces cost or customer acquisition. You can search for CAC. And these are all the titles that solve CAC. So go look at your prospects, go read some of their job descriptions and understand like, what are the titles that actually have this problem?

[00:22:26] And how can you identify, go look at the company? How do you know they actually have this problem? You could even look at things like built with her recent installs and be like, why did this company install, talk to your customers or look at your cases. And th the case studies are usually, it's great. If case studies don't match the marketer's website, you know, it's like, oh my gosh, there's a customer insight that we don't understand.

[00:22:45] And the customer will say we had spent six months trying this thing, and then we moved off of it because this problem, and you're like, oh my gosh. So like, how do you find other people with that problem? And once you start to understand these things, right. Company, right place, right. Title, you know, right.

[00:23:00] Channel. Um, then it's gonna, you're just going to have a much better time because you're focused on the things that are based on actual customer problems and their context, and it's just going to help you. It's going to help you fail less, honestly. Yeah. Well now in your experience, because you've done a lot of these experiments, like how long does it take to kind of, you know, I'm guessing, you know, there's a bit of a learning curve, right?

[00:23:24] With, with taking this sort of approach. If you haven't, you know, done. Done it this way. Um, and maybe, you know, the experiments are maybe less of a guessing game for somebody like you, but for somebody who's never really approached it this way, what should it, do? You know, what does should they expect, you know, to run an experiment and maybe find out, Hey, it's the wrong target or no, the pain doesn't exist.

[00:23:45] And, and to land on something where things, you know, start sort of. I guess I'm in long forum. Yeah. Well, the first thing I'll say is that when I build, uh, you know, I've done a bunch of consulting for companies and I'll come in with people that will go find the leads for me that will be able to go connect up to data sources to combine the data.

[00:24:04] And so I spent a lot of time on the copy alone. Um, but just getting the data is, is actually hard. Like it's, it's hard. Like you gotta go find the email. You gotta like, make sure it's valid. You have to like go enrich the domain with like web traffic data and then you have to like connect it up. Um, and actually I got you, I got your listeners free access to clay.

[00:24:24] So clay.run, um, slash sales transformation. So this is a tool that can combine a lot of those data sets for you. Um, it's pre access, but I, I texted the, uh, texted. They had to go to market. I'm like, yo, you gotta, you gotta hook it up here. Um, so once you combine that, then, uh, I think it's really good for you to hire an outsourcer.

[00:24:42] If there's other bespoke data that you want from some Chrome extension, et cetera. Um, but put the hypotheses down ahead of time, then figure out, you just have to do this for five to 10 domains manually. You're going to start to see the patterns. If you know your customers well enough, put it together in a spreadsheet and send a hundred to 200 emails in any.

[00:25:02] Fairmont and if it doesn't work, stop it. Um, and if it does, then it's like, great. How can I take this to my leadership? If I'm an individual rep and say, we need more resources behind this. Like I threw this together with, you know, a glue in a, uh, glue and duct tape, and now I need to buy some of this data.

[00:25:18] Like we need to hire someone to validate this information. Um, but just get a test off and bring that to your leadership. They're gonna be impressed. Yeah. Yeah. Well said, um, Jordan. This has been a lot of fun. Anything else that we didn't dive into? I feel like, I mean, there's just so many nuggets. I know.

[00:25:38] There's I know you've got any final thoughts before we wrap it up. Yeah. I mean, I want to hit on that first. Place that we started, which is the challenge is not personalization versus scale. That is a false continuum. And you are trapped by that thinking that either I need to send a lot of bad messages to a lot of people or send these one-to-one messages.

[00:26:00] You need to figure out what email am I, is the recipient going to be like, wow, calling you educated me about my. Thank you so much, you know, some piece about my business that I don't, because you did your research and who cares, how long that takes, then you need to remove your context from that email in such a way that you can turn it into a step-by-step process.

[00:26:23] So, Don't believe this idea that you either have to personalize one-on-one with a video about the color of my hat and how much I like cookies, or you have to spam to everyone in the world. I really do like cookies. So if you'd send me, this is the, this is the only exception I'll say, like, if you send me a warm chocolate chip cookie, like I will take that meeting.

[00:26:43] So I just like want to be clear. This is like the exception to the rule locks, sending a warm. Yeah. Hey, yeah, half the bars high the bar as always the bar is high. Yeah. Yeah. Um, all right. So yeah, I mean, that is, I think a big myth that we just busted. So I appreciate you coming on and getting tactical and giving folks some ideas on how they can do that.

[00:27:08] So where can people connect with you? Where can they find out more about all of the awesome things that you're doing? And then you said you have a link for them to get access. Yeah. Yeah. So I, I actually, one of the tools that I use is clay. So I've got, I've got a private link for your listeners that I'll drop in the show notes here so that they can get access to a tool that I've done.

[00:27:26] Some interesting experiments with. Um, I post pretty actively on LinkedIn, uh, in slash Jordan Crawford. I own the, I own the, I own, my name is LinkedIn, which is great. Uh, blueprint, gtm.com. Jordan at blueprint. GTM is, uh, is my email. And what we're doing right now is this pain based approach, uh, scraping job descriptions, helping people mind them for pain structure that pain by keyword groups, and then build ABM and outbound plays that are based on the companies that have your problem now for the entire.

[00:27:56] So that's what I'm up to, and I would love to chat with any of your folks in your audience that I'm actually building a course on how to do this too now. So hopefully in the next month or so, I'll have something that you guys can consume that will give you data sources, uh, you know, problems, how to think about this.

[00:28:11] Um, uh, most of the kind of stuff that we talked about. Awesome. Thank you so much, Jordan. We'll drop all the links in there for everybody in the show notes. If you enjoyed today's episode, please write us a review on whatever podcast platform you're on. It really does help us out and also share the show with your friends.

[00:28:27] And if you want to give us any feedback, we're always listening. You can go to sales, transformation.fm, drop us a voice DM, and we will get back. Hey, you stuck around that tells me you're serious about your own sales transformation. If you're tired of doing things the old way and want to get started in your journey with other people on the same path, head over to sales, cast.community, and crush your numbers on your loadable.

[00:28:50] Yeah. It's free sales cast, doc community. Send me a DM with your best pitch and mentioned this ad. And I might even give you free access to our best templates.