Sales Hustle is now Sales Transformation
Dec. 31, 2021

#221 S2 Episode 90 - From SaaS Sales to Helping Team Close More Deals with Mickeli Bedore

This episode of the Sales Transformation Podcast with Collin Mitchell features Mickeli Bedore, Chief Closing Officer at Closers Media. Mickeli talks about his grueling experience as a door-to-door salesperson, finding success via SaaS sales, and then helping other teams close more deals.

Mickeli is particularly keen in discussing pricing upfront as a way to speed up the buyer's process. This way, you can ensure that you are spending your precious time on deals that you can most likely close.

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  • Cutting one's teeth as a door-to-door salesman in Ohio
  • Diversion as a musician and getting into credit card debt
  • Getting back into sales at Verizon
  • People generally buy from people that they already like
  • Sales is about solving problems for your client


Mickeli: "I didn't know anything about technology, whatever I was selling, but I knew that they had a problem and I, and I knew, and I believe with all my heart, that this software would help with that problem because it's helped so many others just like them." 

Collin: I'd rather lose early and find out that okay, price, not in your budget, doesn't work, we're not on the same page. Totally fine. I got a hundred other people to go talk to, not a big deal. 

Learn more about Mickeli in the links below:

Learn more about Collin in the link below: 

Also, you can join our community by checking out If you're a sales professional looking to take your career to greater heights, please visit us at and set a call with Collin and Chris. 

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[00:00:00] In the world of sales, you either sink or swim or breakthrough to the next level. My name's Colin Mitchell, and this is sales transformation, a new kind of sales show designed to bring you through the epic life-changing moments of elite sellers. So you can experience your own sales transformation.

[00:00:25] All right. Welcome to another episode of sales transformation. I am extremely excited for today's guests. I've got my good friend Nikolai DOR on a I've had him on the show before. Definitely happy to have him back. And Nikolai is the chief closing officer over at closers media. Uh, and he is a small town, C degree C degree ADHD, dreamer that was told you better learn how to swing a hammer because that's your ceiling.

[00:00:53] And we're going to find out a little bit more about make a live story. I don't think you swing a hammer. Oh buddy. I'm the least handy person. There might be some other guy out there, but yeah, no, I'm going to hit a five for sure. I, I might have you beat, um, I mean, if my, if my wife asks me to hang curtains, um, On the ground in less than a week, you know, so true story.

[00:01:21] My, my in-laws are super handy and we do some rentals and some, yeah. And the last time they were here to help, this is no joke and I'm not proud of this. I fought on the, on the yard. Like they were upstairs, like just doing all the stuff and we call them the Amish dolphins because they can fix anything.

[00:01:38] And even like telepathically it's wild, like hammer almost there's a hammer. So I just went outside and started digging holes. I would always use tripping over stuff and getting to the wave. You know what I mean? Like I was just, I was bringing, I was actually bringing it a value and that is that's me as a handyman.

[00:01:57] Yeah. Did, where were more like in, in, in, in ways that I don't think we, I knew. Um, all right. Awesome. So clearly your ceiling was higher than swinging the hammer. And I want to just dig into your story. So take us back. Where did MC lies sales journey? So I, it was called the sales, I, who knows, but, um, I basically.

[00:02:21] So I was at sea at best. And, um, I was getting in trouble for just talk and monkeying around too much and was no future. Like, I didn't even know I was going to college. And, um, actually I was pretty certain I wasn't going to get to college. And my uncle, um, was awesome and black belt in TaeKwonDo and played guitar like stuff.

[00:02:44] And we just got along. He was like way younger, like the younger uncle of my dad's seven other. And, uh, our brother, sorry. But, um, he, uh, he was a sales guy. He sold the pizzas and, uh, he, he invited me along one time just to go on some sales calls because it was summer. I had nothing to do. I was like 14 or 13.

[00:03:03] I don't even know. And anyway, we wanted this, this, the sales calls and I was like, The lunch, drinking pop, like Glint park and like hanging out and playing Frisbee. I'm like, what is this? You get this, this is called silence. And I was like, well, I don't care what call I'm going to do. And, and so that, that kind of began the thing.

[00:03:26] So I went to work for him for a little bit selling pizzas. Then I sold some advertising in college and went door to door in Columbus, Ohio for a Southwestern. So I sold my way through. My ties in for the campus newspaper and then, uh, became an entertainment agent and an intimidation. And after college in Manheim, Which was a stretch from grand forks north.

[00:03:50] Um, and I did that for a little bit, but I realized that, and then what I did is I got a credit card. It made all this money through college, actually enough, like selling that it, you know, I didn't need a lot to live on, but our, and I was like, man, this is awesome. Sales is great. But then it might Manhattan called and did that for silver in a heap of credit card debt because I was entertaining all these entertains.

[00:04:12] Right on a budget. I didn't have gotten a credit card debt and I came back to the cities and then in Denver, right after that, um, I got a sales gig back and that sales has gotten me out of credit card debt. It's allowed us to live, you know, Montana it's it's allowed us, my wife to kind of be a freelance architect that was provided this amazing life for us.

[00:04:37] And, um, so yeah, I think that, you know, that w w. Plan turned up to be an absolute blessing. And I owe all of this life, you know, to sales. Wow. Wow. What a journey. So, uh, it started out selling frozen pizzas and you were, you were hooked. I mean, from there it was just one sales gig after another. Yeah. I'll be to travel the world.

[00:05:02] I mean, even like in college, not that Columbus, Ohio is Narnia by any means, but you know, And I got to go to Nashville and got to go to The Bahamas for a president's club. I know this club trip in college, you know, and, and that was all catered by by sales. Um, and when I veered from it, lo look what happened?

[00:05:24] I got into credit card debt. So in, did you, did I hear correctly that you were doing door to door in Columbus, Ohio? Yes, I was. So they're still alive. They're actually. Like largest deal. You know, they hire college. You, you basically run your own business for a summer. They give you a territory, you got to go find a place to live, which you run your own little business and you have your own little like accounting.

[00:05:52] I mean, you really run like a business and you, uh, uh, books and DVD, errands, CDs and stuff, uh, to families educational. And it was wild, man. It was like Appalachian. So I got, I got bit by some dogs, like a bit by a pygmy goat. Like no joke that I got a couple of guns pulled, what the heck is a pygmy goat.

[00:06:11] They're like a mini goat. They're like, uh, like a, like a, but like the size of a puppy, not a puppy. Like, I mean like a beagle you're tiny. Yeah. Wow. I mean, it was, it was dicey, you know, it was a lot of. To get bit by a goat, kind of topped it off.

[00:06:35] Um, well, I mean, it sounds like what an incredible experience though, right? I mean, I always have a ton of respect for people who've done door to door in any capacity because, um, it just, I th I feel like it's, it's probably a pretty humbling experience and, and, and there's just, I mean, it's a tough gig, right?

[00:06:54] I mean, it's one thing to call somebody and interrupt their day, but to knock on somebody's door and interrupt their day is a totally different situation. Yeah, it sucked. I'm not gonna lie to you. The job did suck, but, but what, but the pain was temporary because the, after that, like I need 30 grand that summer I was living on dollars a semester.

[00:07:16] So 30 grand was like a million dollars. Um, you know, but not only that, it taught me if someone says they're young and they're like, ah, I would do this job again. If I were, if I were to get. Tommy self-discipline resiliency, uh, how to talk to adults because you're talking about their family. Like you're not just trying to sell them a widget.

[00:07:38] This is like education for their children. Totally different conversation. Um, you learn how to present value, right? You learn how to run a day, learn how to run a business. I mean, it was a resonate. I think it's still have it on there. Like I get people all the time. They're like, Hey, you did Southwestern.

[00:07:58] It sounded like a being a Marine. It's like a badge of honor, you know? Cause everyone knows it was hard. You can do that. You can do anything. So, you know, it was. I've had a lot of like, you know, I've, I've had, uh, I've, uh, uh, had a lot of people on this show that have cut their teeth selling Cutco similar.

[00:08:18] Yeah. Yeah. But I love, I love that you basically early on like, sort of got some entrepreneurial experience, right? Like a lot of times they say good salespeople are. You know, people, um, but to actually like run your own territory, run your own business and have to like, see the bigger picture than just like I show up.

[00:08:39] I do my job. I collect a check check is so valuable. Totally. It's it was like I said, it was, it was, it was hard. It was, it was worth it, man. Like, and now I'm not telling anyone my address here, but, uh, and I played, I think we bought, we bought every, everything we bought, every book these kids sell twice.

[00:08:59] Like when they come. And this happens that some of my other buddies who sold books, it's like it, the book club, like the kid comes to your door, selling Cutco or whatever I'm buying. I don't care what it is. Like I'll just donate it or something, you know? Cause I know what they're going through and he asked any other person sold Cutco or door to door.

[00:09:18] They're buying that someone shows up at their door they're buying. Yeah. Don't be surprised if, uh, after this drops live, you, your ding, your doorbell just starts going crazy. Everybody's coming to your house.

[00:09:33] It's funny though, because I'm bit of a sucker too. Like if somebody does a good job, like so nice. I'll buy it. Even if I don't know. Just out of like, respect for, you know, the hustle and like, you know what it's like, and you're like, you know what? You did a pretty darn good job. So, you know, you feel like you want to reward them.

[00:09:54] So I get absolutely. I see. It's the same deal, man. Like, I, I, it, I bought and stuff and my wife's just like, really? Are you ever going to use this? Probably not, probably not between Instagram, late at night and, uh, and door to door. I think

[00:10:15] I'll just stop. I don't need.

[00:10:19] Yeah. All right. So let's fast forward a little bit, uh, in, in, so, you know, you made your way all the way to Manhattan. What was that like in you, in, in, in that, that was the point where you got out of sales a little bit and you were doing something. Yeah. I mean, you don't know how good you gone, right. Or whatever that saying is, um, cause I was selling all through college and I always paid my own bills.

[00:10:42] I put myself through college for the most part. I mean, my parents helped a little bit, um, Yeah, I didn't have a lot of debt coming out of college, which was why it was so stupid to go into debt. But anyway, um, that's when my and Hatton from grand forks, um, I stepped away. Uh, I was, I'm a musician too. So that's part of the alert is, um, I was playing music in grand forks and some bands.

[00:11:04] I was booking bands that, um, so that was, I got to have these agencies and I was, I worked hard at it, you know, I liked it.

[00:11:16] A, one of them lives in Manhattan. And I was like, man, I've never been in New York. So. I took off, but the culture shift was shocking because my boss, um, we w w then I lived in Rockland county because I couldn't afford Manhattan lived just across the GW bridge. And, um, and that's where our office was Manhattan all the time to, to scout, uh, you know, comics or, or bands or whatever.

[00:11:42] And so I would have shoot make me drive. I don't know. So I had to drive, so I don't, if you've ever dropped in after. And think about gravel roads and like two lane highways in North Dakota, all of a sudden I'm dropping into Manhattan and to death, every time I took that drive in, I was just like, oh God, please don't make me drive.

[00:11:59] And every time she would been in it's people walking across the street doors, fling and potholes, I was just like, hold on for dear life. Wow. That's funny. Manhattan's a good place. Then they shifted us off to, to Philly. Um, Philly was all right, but, uh, That's great. I lived in Delaware, actually. I was living in Delaware when Joe Flocko, I don't know if he's still playing or not.

[00:12:23] It's there. And it was like watching tech level. I probably to age myself there, but it was like somebody just like a man amongst children, he would just cock back and just bomb, like bomb it to the end zone. I bet they'd score like a hundred points when he was quarterback, because it was like a video game.

[00:12:39] He just cocked back and um, and then I, and then I got, I got over these coasts. The travel and the fast paced. Uh, and the debt, I was just like, I gotta get outta here. Then I came back to the cities and took a sales gig with Verizon and then got delayed. And they, they gave me an opportunity to move to Denver.

[00:12:58] So that's where I finished my Verizon career in and then paid off. Thanks to sales. I mean, once again, you know, wow. I don't think I ever realized how much you've, uh, you've moved around and, and, and had these different little lives in different parts of the country. Yeah. It's not something that anyone asks me about ever.

[00:13:17] So like if someone asks, I tell them, I forget about stuff good or bad that you've you've done. But, um, that was, uh, that was a. That was a good experience. I, after that, I went out to the east coast and did that and got to live out life and then come back and really appreciate things, you know? Um, so your first six months in the cities, and then I got shot down at Denver and lived there for about four, I think.

[00:13:43] Okay. So tell me about a Verizon, like, is, is, was there any like mentors or, or, you know, big experiences for you in your sales roles that, uh, that have really kind of molded and shaped, like the work that you're doing? Oh for sure. I mean, my boss down there, his name was Jim, but you've read good to great by Jim Collins.

[00:14:04] I think that's the book Jim Collins is if I have not, I have not book. It might as well be how to win friends and influence people. It's like, it's like a very popular book anyways, by Jim Collins. But my boss, his name is Jim Collins. So he had all these books. He had like eight. Behind him. Like he, when I interviewed there, I was like, are you Jim Collins?

[00:14:27] And he didn't call ins, but he didn't ever act like he was, had a really dry sense of humor. And I thought that to this day, that is the funniest thing I like. Just to play a prank and everybody that came into his office. But anyway, yeah, he was a sales manager enterprise Rent-A-Car which if you know anyone that's ever worked there, that is a grind.

[00:14:46] And he came to Verizon, Verizon back in advertising and SEO element. So they sold Google ad word. Like we sold Google stuff. We sold yellow page. Oh, really? Kinds of stuff. Yeah. It got sold a long time ago, but back then they had that. G his enterprise days, he came in and just, he was instrumental in my sales development.

[00:15:09] I've heard that enterprise has like a phenomenal sales training program. And all the managers, like if you're looking to hire a sales manager, I don't care what you sell, hire an enterprise sales manager. Like they are, I've heard that before, like, is, is, is, uh, people poach people from enterprise all the time, because that's just like, we know they've been trained well.

[00:15:30] Oh, it's phenomenal. I mean, there was the office, there was full of them. There's like a, there's a couple of guys that, that also came from enterprise and, um, they were phenomenal also. Kinda Jim and Jim and I got to enjoy that was my second or third president's club. I can't remember which, or we got to go to Montreal during the fireworks.

[00:15:53] It was interesting, um, fun to internet. He, I will say right now that my uncle got me into sales via just inspiration, really shaped my early sales development from just a system standpoint. Follow-ups just basic stuff that he was just epic at. He was kind of like the anti sales, quiet, introverted, which now we've seen that as a really great profile of salespeople.

[00:16:23] Yeah, it had to be loud and obnoxious like me. You needed to have the gift of the gab.

[00:16:31] Cause we just enjoy each other's company. We were so opposite that we got along very well. And, um, Batman, because we just closed deals constantly because cause cause he, some people. Person and central dedicated yes. The non-com person, which I followed from there on out. So after, uh, Verizon, uh, I went to con I went to Oracle and then I went to.

[00:17:00] And I was able to leverage that. So B meaning I'd bring a tech with me, texts are generally introverted, so on and so forth. Right. And so I just would be like, Hey, could I, and you know, we always had the resources, took them up on it. They, no one would ever take their texts. And I'm like, well, I don't want to learn this crap.

[00:17:19] Like, I don't care if it's shit about this kind of stuff or pretend like I know it right. Yeah. I'm not gonna pretend to know why everyone can read right through. So you bring the tech cause that's what they're paid to do anyway. And what happens is that people gravitate towards one or the other. So you have a way of getting the deal because they like one of you, right?

[00:17:41] Like, yeah. But some people are like, oh, I'm a dumb person. I don't mean dumb, but like, I don't know this crap either. Right. And then yeah, people then they'll. It was wild, the techie people like, so, so, so with Jim, where you, the ice and then, and then in your new roles, you became the fire. Oh no, I was, I was always fired.

[00:18:00] Maybe I was so Jim, Jim Collins, Jim, what? It was it, uh, Jim was, uh, he was ice. So, and that's how it always went like Iceman, methodical, you know, intelligent, introverted person and the. Looks like a quarterback in the buyer experience, but you know, I can see, I can kind of see you as, or I could, I could see you as there either though I could see you as, you know, whatever, when you need to be now, we're all chameleons.

[00:18:37] Aren't we, you in sales, like I will,

[00:18:43] I will be whatever. But with, with Jim, it taught me that that's a thing, like, you know, just don't like you and it's it's it's okay. You know what I mean? But at the end of the day you have, they're not going to buy it unless they need it and they trust you. They're just not, it's not going to happen. You know what I mean?

[00:19:03] They have to trust you and they have. But you what you have and lots of times they might not know they do need it. You know, that's part of your job. Yeah. Why is it some people? Why is it that there's some people that sit on the other side of the fence of that think of that, know that liking and trust in you doesn't matter.

[00:19:21] I don't know how I just disagree with that. I mean, all right, who knows? Am I wrong? Maybe? Um, but I, I just know that I'm not going to buy something from somebody that I don't like, and that could be anything like things I don't any sort of, a lot of stories from being honest with you, but let's say I do. I go to the ski shop down the road right there that I like.

[00:19:45] And there's a guy that I don't, and guess who I give my business to the gal. Right. Yes. It's the same. Like I'll just leave and wait for her to come back, you know? Um, he's actually not that bad, but I just prefer her because he asks good questions. She's always talks to my kids at a, at a, at a normal level, like a, you know, like a giant and just certain things she does now.

[00:20:11] You can't force someone to like you, I don't think. Um, but people try though. I've seen people that just overly, you know, and I can see through it and you probably could too. Right. Where people just try too hard to try to get you to like them to try to use it as a tactic selling. You're just like I could see right through that.

[00:20:31] Not working. Sorry. It makes me immediately not like you. Yeah. Now back a little bit. Cause you know, Well, you don't have to like them. You have to trust them. I would say that's true. But what happened, someone? What do you think happens? You start to like them, you start to appreciate them. They trust that they know.

[00:20:53] I just want to trust that you have my best interest at heart. And I think there's like gray people think like, oh, liking them means like, I want to be friends and go out and have a drink or play golf and do all these things that are kind of like a old school selling mentality. Right. Where it's like, no, I trust you.

[00:21:08] And I like you enough to want to do business with you and have somewhat of a business or professional relationship with you where I don't feel like you're going to be a pain in the ass to deal with. Right? Yeah. Are you, are you. Methodical. Do you have a process? Like, are you going to tell me what's coming next or do I have to guess like all those things that's like, and maybe some of listening, that's not liking that's something else.

[00:21:32] And that might be true. That puts me first. You know, I like it when it comes to me, exchanging my heart, it came money for whatever they're offering. I want, I, I w I want a good X, which is what we do here. That's what we focus on the buyer journey, because it's really all that mattered. Yeah. Hell I didn't know anything about technology, whatever I was selling, but I knew that they had a problem and I, and I knew, and I believe with all my heart, that this software would help with that problem because it's helped so many others just like them.

[00:22:06] And this person next to me, this ice ice man, um, is a proven expert in that. And all I have to do is we ask great questions. We're empathetic. We listen, we, we, we go a little bit. We qualify, we learn, and then we set the next stage or sorry, the next test. And we just commit to doing that, that sequence over and over and over again.

[00:22:33] Tales. It's not that hard, but it is.

[00:22:41] Uh, so, all right. So tell me more about, you know, some of the success stories and the things that you guys are doing over there today at closers. Um, you know, what type of problems are people having when they come to you? How are, you know, what are you doing to solve those problems? And tell me some of the amazing stories that you guys.

[00:22:59] We we've had some, some good stories as this, this year, but there's three that I'm like super proud of. Um, one of them was a software development company. One was a, was a media com or, uh, and then, uh, this most recent one is a business brokerage, which is a business I've in love with. So it might be broken some business on the side.

[00:23:21] We'll see. But, um, The F a marketing company that, uh, so sorry, the tie into all these, see, what's the theme. So let's just kinda know what I'm teeing up here is we sell us a proven sales system set of plays if you will, that we will implement and coach on, um, for companies just so people know what we do. W what we focused on is we kind of need three months sprints on muscles that need to be developed.

[00:23:54] Like I've never come across anyone who's in a sales role that sucks at everything. Sales realize we're consulting that, eh, maybe they don't need all this. So we just focus on the muscles that need to be strengthened the areas. Right. But it's part of this, this system. Anyway, these three. Did not. And so they were just selling by the seat of their pants.

[00:24:18] The business brokerage had literally like two to two. Usually what I'll do sometimes is I'll, I'll jump in and take a role for a week or two. I understand where are the real pains and challenges because people can tell you that all my, my, my back is sore. Well, yeah, your backs are because your knees are tweaked and your F you're hobbling on the foot because you got like, there's a lot of other problems.

[00:24:44] That is one problem. Usually, you know, like a lot of people thinks I have a leads problem or problem, you know, you have a close, you have a conversion problem, you know, Um, we can, we can debate that all day long, but yeah, it isn't just one, one problem. There's generally other problems that feed that problem.

[00:25:00] So we want to get to the root of that problem. Right. Um, so with, uh, th th th thing that was really cool was, um, they didn't have a system which, which was one, but then they didn't have. Since he didn't have a system that they weren't following, it was impeding their ability to, to hire, you know, hires. What we did is we kind of found, well, where can we focus to have the most success right away?

[00:25:30] One of them was the way they were PR media company. What we did is we, we tweaked how they were proposing. So that one was qualifying like during the initial kind of conversation, then. Like basically setting up the, like, here's the, here's the next few steps in our buying process or our sales process, what you want to call it, their proposal.

[00:25:52] They were getting murdered on the proposal and this happened over and over. So that's why I started jumping on calls. I'm like I got what they were doing and this is what a lot of people do wrong. So this is kind of success story. Number one, is that how to qualify and ask the right questions to just see if this is even a real thing.

[00:26:08] They were already, they were already decent at that, but when it came to propose. Beautiful. All this stuff that they've done for people and everything made sense, but price, it would literally take, let's say we had a 60 minute conversation or meeting set up. It would get it's five or eight minutes. Yeah.

[00:26:27] And then they, they spring price. So they had eight minutes to do that price. Right. And, and in the qualifying stuff, they weren't asking about budget or even just. Budget they're just full of it. So they got to the pros and then all of a sudden, and then they get ghosts, they get ghosted and it happened over and over and over.

[00:26:46] And finally I was like, aha, that's the chink in the armor. That's the part that we really need. Switch around. So they would do like, Hey, here's what we talked about. Last time here is the agenda that you've had. And I sent it again and here it is, and this is right. We, so we greeted that. So everything is nodding here is the pains and challenges that we are here to discuss that we believe that we can fix blah, blah, blah.

[00:27:11] Yes and no. So it was constantly reaffirming. And then we go, great. So, you know, w and. Right into it, we'll say. Okay. So just before we get started, I want to make sure that we're on the same page as far as Terry, you know that this looks, now, this is high-level isn't specific, but I want to give a range just so you guys know that this investment will look like now.

[00:27:34] I told you that in the last conversation, I just wanted you to see it. We can pause any questions, thoughts, and we get it right away. And what happened? You don't happen. People go, Nope. Makes sense. And then we move on. It was a weirdest thing and then we'd do it at the end. Oh, it cause you waste. Oh, you know, like all they hear is price at the end, but if you do it, the beginning prices out of the way, then you go through patient, you give them the solve and then you remind them at the end on.

[00:28:02] Just so we're clear. You think there's a problem about how much this investment would w w would require, are we still all on the same page? Same eight minutes. Now, this sounds good. Great. Any questions? Any concerns? Nope. Here's the next steps that I do, as you know, I'm gonna send it to legal. I'm going to do this.

[00:28:22] I'm gonna do that. Blah, blah, blah. And any problems with that? Nope. Great. Well, I'm gonna give you five minutes back of your time and I'll be following up. Uh, I'll say, why don't we schedule something? Morrow at two, just to make sure that we've, you know, legal has had a chance to look at it all, think everything, and we're all good to go.

[00:28:41] And that's what we changed it to. And I just got a text from their, their, uh, their revenues were around half a million bucks because they they're they're brand new. They were. That's a good revenue for a small team. Um, they just closed that much less this last quarter. Wow. This quarter, this month, I think it was list.

[00:29:01] I think it was last quarter. You know, what I love about that story is it's it goes in and it goes against what a lot of people say, right? Don't talk about price too early, make sure you lead in front load with all of the value before you get priced. Even it's funny. Cause I actually just. Recorded a solo podcast episode, talking about pricing and how to be upfront and transparent about it from the beginning.

[00:29:30] Um, and so that's why I just love this story so much. I didn't even know that this was the story you were going to tell, but, um, because I'd rather lose early and find out okay. Price, not in your budget. Doesn't work. We're not on the same page. Totally fine. I got a hundred other people to go talk to, not a big deal.

[00:29:48] Um, then waste a bunch of time. I mean, some people won't even talk price on the first call. It's like, oh no, they'll Dodge the questions. Oh, I'm so sorry. We have to, I don't know. We have to talk about all these other things and I need to check all these boxes in my sales process before I can even give you a range and you know what to be fair.

[00:30:06] Like if you have a complex product, Kind of get it, but you can still, you've done enough if you've been doing it long enough, you've done enough deals where you have an idea of what something's going to maybe cost and I'm, I'm totally in the camp of like you should address it early and upfront.

[00:30:23] Absolutely. One of the, one of the things that we always coach on is in that first initial call, you know, ask a question and one, nothing. Timeline and they do have a budget allocated, uh, or at least approved for it. Just say, have you done any research? On what a solution like this may cost. Have you done any?

[00:30:49] No, I haven't. Okay. So then I would say, you know, we're going to put together based on our. During our discovery call. So that's not today. Just so you're aware, you know, the range, the range for something like this falls between N and N. Do those numbers shock scare you, you know, is that, are we, are we on the same page?

[00:31:17] Um, yeah, that's what I really found that to be wildly successful and most nine times out of 10, they go, no, that's about, that's about right? Yeah. We talked about it. Remember we talked about last time. Yep. Here it is. Again, anything. Find scary and nothing's changed on our end, but has it changed in years?

[00:31:33] Yeah. Nope. You know, and you get it out right away and it's comfortable for, for people to say, gee, have you done any digging? Have you done any research? Lots of like this before? Nope. Um, okay. Well just so you know, so we can get this out of the way range that you could anticipate, you know, investing in something like this is that.

[00:31:57] Yeah. Yeah, man. Sometimes every now and then it does. They're like, that's way more than I thought. Okay. Yeah. What did you think? What, like, unfortunately, is this a deal killer? Yes, it is. I can't afford that. No problem. Maybe not today. Maybe not ever, but what's the point. You're not going to. This is why I don't understand.

[00:32:25] You're going to trick someone into buying something they don't want or need. Yeah, that's called a scam.

[00:32:35] Yeah. And if, and if that's what you're doing, uh, then you're somebody that's giving all of us a bad name. You're killing the reputation of the sales profession. Stop it. Stop it right now. Yeah. That's incentive for that. If you truly love people, like most sales people, do you really, really do care?

[00:32:58] Approaching pricing that way is the fairest way to do it because it saves you time. And it does it doesn't well, if you even think about like, I don't know about you, but do you ever know. Come across a website, you know, maybe you see an ad or maybe you see, maybe they send you a cold email or whatever.

[00:33:17] Somehow you come across something that looks interesting, or maybe I need this. I'm not sure. And you go, and then you go to a pricing page and it's like, it's got everything, but the price

[00:33:32] drives me nuts. Like. Think about it from the buyer's perspective of like taking time out of their day to schedule a call with you, you know, hoping to probably get one of the things that's top of mind for them, like, you know, can we afford this? Is this in our budget? What does it cost and dancing around or dodging the question it's frustrating.

[00:33:54] That's yeah. Especially for products when you're emotionally detached from it. Like, if this is. I want you to build me up. That's more complex. Right. But that, that could require some, some phone calls and some meetings. But if I just want to Everett, why do I have to talk to a salesperson? And I, this is a sales book.

[00:34:14] Know it's old software, all enterprise. Software's a little different, you know, but it's QuickBooks, SAS software, you know, I mean, it depends on how many licenses, right? If it's Sunday, let me download it. But. Yeah, that, that was, that was, that is a story that I will not just with the money that they made, but they're another hiring like crazy.

[00:34:37] Um, there's some personal win life that I probably don't need to share. That was really positive for them. Um, yeah,

[00:34:49] I'm proud of that one. The one that we're working on right now is interesting. It's a business brokerage. That's an interesting business. Uh, It's like ground level, I mean, thousand business brokers in the country, and there's a hundred thousand realtors and like, it's really it's right. And it's been, it's been, it's an old, it's an old business that hasn't, that hasn't really been shaken up in a while.

[00:35:18] And now it's, this group is, is one of them. That's, that's trained to do that, but, um, a lot of people that are going to work there. And they're like CFO, you know, formal, you know, a lot of, a lot of real intelligent mathematicians, uh, or whatever,

[00:35:37] which I tell people it's, it's interesting. They just, they were convinced that the only way to do that business is by shaking hands and golfing and crushing beers. And, and, um, our, one of our products is a virtual sales system and I was like, I don't think that's true. So, if you think you can do it virtually, you can help.

[00:36:01] It's again, because our talent pool of who we can hire will increase. We'll have a system, so we don't need, and that's been the case and in a short amount of time, these guys love it. Love it. Make lie. It's been fantastic having you on the show, man. Uh, always a good time having you. Loved the stories. Love learning a little bit, a few new things about you that I didn't know as well.

[00:36:27] So any final thoughts? Where can people get into world if they want? Well, first of all, thanks for having the show. I'm a huge fan of yours. You know, obviously we're friends, but you know what you're putting out there. All the content is, is, is amazing and it's enjoyable and it's, it's, it's lifting, you know, the brand that is this career called sales.

[00:36:45] So kudos to you and thanks for, for doing what you do. And thanks for having me on, um, Uh, as far as finding us, so closers, I got a website, Nicola Um, I'm very active on LinkedIn. I'm not really active on anything else. So LinkedIn, uh, it's Labrador. Um, we do coffee and closers once a month.

[00:37:04] So if you're down with that, you can get free tickets and, uh, we have some great. Which, by the way, I need to schedule for 20, 22, but we'll talk about that offline. Um, so you can find us there. And we're always trying to, we're trying to keep up with calling here and, uh, trying to put as much great content as we can, but yeah.

[00:37:21] Connect on LinkedIn, shoot an email off, uh, you know, set up a media. I'd love to get to know you. Awesome. Thanks man so much. And don't forget if you sell door to door, make sure you hit Nikolai's door. You're sure to close. Uh, if you enjoyed today's episode, please write us a review, share the show with your friends.

[00:37:39] It really does help us out. And we're also listening for your feedback. So hop over to sales, drop us a voice DM, and I will get back to you. Hey, you stopped. That tells me you're serious about your own sales transformation. If you're tired of doing things the old way and want to get started in your journey with other people on the same path, head over to sales,, and crush your numbers on your leaderboard.

[00:38:05] Yeah. It's free sales cast, doc community. Send me a DM with your best pitch and mention this ad. And I might even give you free access to our best templates.